Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.
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Buddy
Joined: 01 Oct 2012 Posts: 15
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Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 9:14 am Post subject: VILLIERS 98cc jr deluxe engine |
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Having a bit of a problem with this engine. It runs for a short time and then cuts out. I have been told its either the coil or the condenser. Well not being very engine minded, how can I test the both of them before spending money on replacements. Just out of interest the engine is fitted in a 1940 Coventry Eagle Auto Ette. Many Thanks.[/b] |
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welder
Joined: 26 Nov 2007 Posts: 265 Location: North Warwickshire
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Posted: Sun May 12, 2013 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Buddy, the fact that it starts and runs at all indicates that coil and condenser are probably ok.
In all probability the engine's crankshaft seals have hardened, allowing air to be drawn into the crankcase and weakening the mixture to the point where it just stops.
Try an old Indian trick. Fill crankcase with petrol, leave full for a couple of hours then drain. The petrol frequently softens hard seals and returns them to working order.
Ian |
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Ironhead
Joined: 28 Mar 2010 Posts: 458 Location: Leicestershire
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Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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you could ring the specialists Buddy,(Villiers Services),they should be able to give you advice. |
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Kelsham
Joined: 18 Jan 2009 Posts: 349 Location: Llandrindod Wells Powys
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Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 7:43 am Post subject: |
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A condensor is cheap enough to just substitute, they are not easy to test without proper equipment.
Are you getting a spark at the plug? what are the points like? A failed condensor will cause arcing at the points and erode them away.
I will be away for a few days so will not be able to give further advice until next week.
Hope you sort it soon, Kels. |
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255dropside
Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 31 Location: Northamptonshire
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Posted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:41 pm Post subject: Testing capacitors |
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Only a very rough "good or bad" test.
You only need an older moving coil or analogue type multi meter, a fairly decent one though.
Get your capacitor (condensers are used in chemistry?) and meter together, put meter onto highest Ohms setting X100 or X10,000 or whatever yours is.
Simply put the leads, noticing their polarity, one on the body and the other on the wire coming out.
Quickly turn the knob on the meter to it's lowest setting on DC or direct current.
Then you must swap the leads around in the opposite way to which they were when you did the first thing, IE: charged the capacitor up.
You should get a nice positive "kick" from the needle.
If not try again a couple of times to be really sure, if you don't swap the leads over, the "kick" will occur backwards, not enough voltage to do any damage, but best to get it right first time.
You are only "bleeding" the charge back out that you put in via your meter's battery.
No kick at all generally means an open circuit.
A constant low or medium reading means a shorting out inside.
This is not an infallible test; I repair lawnmowers trade, and although I've tested thousands in my time, mower engines have now gone "all electronic no points or capacitor being used any more. So this knowledge is almost useless to future generations, except old bike and mowers etc owners of course! _________________ regards, David. |
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255dropside
Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 31 Location: Northamptonshire
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Posted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:44 pm Post subject: Testing capacitors |
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Only a very rough "good or bad" test.
You only need an older moving coil or analogue type multi meter, a fairly decent one though.
Get your capacitor (condensers are used in chemistry?) and meter together, put meter onto highest Ohms setting X100 or X10,000 or whatever yours is.
Simply put the leads, noticing their polarity, one on the body and the other on the wire coming out.
Quickly turn the knob on the meter to it's lowest setting on DC or direct current.
Then you must swap the leads around in the opposite way to which they were when you did the first thing, IE: charged the capacitor up.
You should get a nice positive "kick" from the needle.
If not try again a couple of times to be really sure, if you don't swap the leads over, the "kick" will occur backwards, not enough voltage to do any damage, but best to get it right first time.
You are only "bleeding" the charge back out that you put in via your meter's battery.
No kick at all generally means an open circuit.
A constant low or medium reading means a shorting out inside.
This is not an infallible test; I repair lawnmowers trade, and although I've tested thousands in my time, mower engines have now gone "aa electronic no points or capacitor being used any more. So this knowledge is almost useless to future generations, except old bike and mowers etc owners of course! _________________ regards, David. |
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rudy
Joined: 25 Mar 2014 Posts: 1
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Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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Hello, I'm from belgium and I has 2 coventry eagle 98cc
if need advice or documentation contact me! |
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D4B
Joined: 28 Dec 2010 Posts: 2083 Location: Hampshire UK
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Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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In my experience, a coil can break down just when it gets hot, so this would mean you could start ok from cold, but then experience problems as it gets up to temprerature.
I had a 1981 Toyota Celica which did exactly this, I used to break down every day on the way to work at more or less the same place, let it cool down and off I went for another mile or two!!!
Got silly in the end stopping more and more frequently, finally diagnosed as faulty coil when hot!
I am not of course suggesting that your lovely Villiers shares much in common with an old Japanese sports car
Good Luck
Just realized this question was posted last year so hopefully my advice is wasted |
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255dropside
Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 31 Location: Northamptonshire
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Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 9:35 pm Post subject: coils |
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Magneto coils would not really get hot I believe, a car's DC coil takes DC current directly from the car's battery, whereas the magneto coil is working on very tiny amounts of current yet quite high voltages induced by static magnets and coils of wire.
Two totally different systems I'm afraid! _________________ regards, David. |
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Jonv8
Joined: 28 Jan 2009 Posts: 66
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Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: coils |
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255dropside wrote: | Magneto coils would not really get hot I believe, a car's DC coil takes DC current directly from the car's battery, whereas the magneto coil is working on very tiny amounts of current yet quite high voltages induced by static magnets and coils of wire.
Two totally different systems I'm afraid! |
In this case I'm afraid you are wrong,the coil and capacitor/condenser hide behind the flywheel of the engine and suck up heat from the crankcases.
In my world of pre65 trials Villiers engines have gained massively in popularity in recent years,and have been made more reliable by moving the capacitor and HT coil up under the fuel tank where they run in cool air. I think in some cases people also use the lighting coil to provide the LT supply for ignition,although this wont help if you are still running a full lighting circuit.I can recommend Villiers services as a helpful and decent parts supplier. |
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