classic car forum header
Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
Register     Posting Photographs     Privacy     F/book OCC Facebook     OCC on Patreon

1937 Morris 8 - dry seized engine.
Goto page 1, 2, 3 ... 9, 10, 11  Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration. Forum Index -> All our old cars, vans, lorries etc
Author Message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 8:06 pm    Post subject: 1937 Morris 8 - dry seized engine. Reply with quote

Well, I threatened to get my 1937 Morris 8 Series 1 back on the road, just for fun. Now my son has decided to marry his lady this year and would love to arrive at the church in Old Morris so I guess I'd better get on with it!

To this end I've dug it out from the back of the garage today and washed it, emptied it of the fishing tackle that I've stored in it for many years and pumped the tyres up. A bit. After 20 years of standing all 5 tyres were still holding air and continue to do so.

I was disappointed, but not surprised, to find that the engine doesn't turn over, even with my full weight on the end of the starting handle. I'm assuming a dry siezure as the car was driven to it's spot all those years ago, and was running fine.

So far I've removed the spark plugs and poured light engine oil into the cylinders. What else should I do, please?

All advice welcomed.

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Diesel can be good for freeing engines.

When I bought my '32 Minor 2-seater, the engine was seized on that too. At first I'd assumed one (or more) piston(s) had seized in the bore(s), in fact one or two valves were stuck in their guides, causing the engine to be stuck, so it might be the same problem with your Morris 8.

RJ

(PS it sounds like your project warrants its own thread in the Your Cars section Wink)
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rick wrote:
Diesel can be good for freeing engines.

When I bought my '32 Minor 2-seater, the engine was seized on that too. At first I'd assumed one (or more) piston(s) had seized in the bore(s), in fact one or two valves were stuck in their guides, causing the engine to be stuck, so it might be the same problem with your Morris 8.

RJ

(PS it sounds like your project warrants its own thread in the Your Cars section Wink)


Rick, thanks for the tip about diesel, I may well give it a go if the light oil route doesn't work.

Tomorrow I'm going in to work, not for anything business driven but to collect my Imperial/BSW/BSF tools and a couple of trolley jacks, axle stands and all things pertaining to vehicle advancement. Oh, and bigger hammers......

I'm going to try a socket or large ring spanner on the crank pulley nut and see if I can get the engine to cooperate into at least turning over. A length of scaff tube over a 1/2" square drive power bar can be persuasive, I find. Maybe I'll dig out my collection of 3/4" square drive kit, left over from when I used to repair motorway construction bulldozers and stuff. The very sight of this lot should frighten the Morris into rotation, if not actual running.

I'll report back. Is there some way that I can transfer this lot to the Morris bit on the Your Cars section?

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

welder wrote:
Rick wrote:
Diesel can be good for freeing engines.

When I bought my '32 Minor 2-seater, the engine was seized on that too. At first I'd assumed one (or more) piston(s) had seized in the bore(s), in fact one or two valves were stuck in their guides, causing the engine to be stuck, so it might be the same problem with your Morris 8.

RJ

(PS it sounds like your project warrants its own thread in the Your Cars section Wink)


Rick, thanks for the tip about diesel, I may well give it a go if the light oil route doesn't work.

Tomorrow I'm going in to work, not for anything business driven but to collect my Imperial/BSW/BSF tools and a couple of trolley jacks, axle stands and all things pertaining to vehicle advancement. Oh, and bigger hammers......

I'm going to try a socket or large ring spanner on the crank pulley nut and see if I can get the engine to cooperate into at least turning over. A length of scaff tube over a 1/2" square drive power bar can be persuasive, I find. Maybe I'll dig out my collection of 3/4" square drive kit, left over from when I used to repair motorway construction bulldozers and stuff. The very sight of this lot should frighten the Morris into rotation, if not actual running.

I'll report back. Is there some way that I can transfer this lot to the Morris bit on the Your Cars section?

Ian


I'll move it over for you now, let us know how you get on Smile

RJ
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MVPeters



Joined: 28 Aug 2008
Posts: 822
Location: Northern MA, USA

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One old trick is to hang something heavy, like another engine block, off the end of the scaffolding pipe, a couple of feet off the ground.
Just leave it there.
There should be a loud thud in the middle of the night.
_________________
Mike - MVPeters at comcast.net
2002 MINI Cooper 'S'
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
ukdave2002



Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 4100
Location: South Cheshire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

welder wrote:



I'm going to try a socket or large ring spanner on the crank pulley nut and see if I can get the engine to cooperate into at least turning over. A length of scaff tube over a 1/2" square drive power bar can be persuasive, I find. Maybe I'll dig out my collection of 3/4" square drive kit, left over from when I used to repair motorway construction bulldozers and stuff. The very sight of this lot should frighten the Morris into rotation, if not actual running.

I'll report back. Is there some way that I can transfer this lot to the Morris bit on the Your Cars section?

Ian


H Ian

Just be careful, it’s quite easy to sheer the starter dog off, I have done it is similar circumstances on my 8 Embarassed as the thread into the crank is much smaller than the crank nut!

Cheers

Dave
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Kelsham



Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
Location: Llandrindod Wells Powys

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would try heating the pistons, Blow lamp, or heated oil. then work the crank back and forth, Being heavy handed will likely cause damage.

Don't ask.

Regards Kels
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MVPeters wrote:
One old trick is to hang something heavy, like another engine block, off the end of the scaffolding pipe, a couple of feet off the ground.
Just leave it there.
There should be a loud thud in the middle of the night.


Mike, I've taken a similar, but different, route.

I've set the starting handle into the "pull-up" position and placed a length of timber beneath it so that part of the weight of the car is pushing down onto the handle. There was a loud thud in the middle of the night. I fell out of bed, probably abetted by my wife. She'll swear I was snoring, if challenged.

Dave, I've been thinking along the same lines. I shall, if necessary, devise something that will enable me to grip the crank pulley to aid rotation, having removed the dynamo belt, of course.

Onwards and upwards. All my son can talk about is his upcoming nuptials, all I can think about is the ever increasing list of Morris things to do. One of which is to devise a pair of drivers' seat runners. I lent mine as patterns to a friend, years ago. They were in his Rover Vitesse when it was stolen, never to be recovered! I've got the bits that bolt to the base of the seat but not the bits that they slide in/fix to the wooden tapered thingies that bolt to the floor.

Is it worth persuading my son that Winter Weddings are very fashionable? Winter 2014 looking favourite Shocked

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ha! A quantum leap forward. I've found the keys for Old Morris.

Well, I say found. I mentioned to my wife that I'd need to be looking for them fairly soon and she looked at me over her glasses. Usually a bad portent, I'll admit. However, her response was in the positive. "If they're the ones with a 1937 penny coin as the keyfob, they're in the corner of your sock drawer".

I married well. Coin is currently soaking in Daddies Brown Sauce for added shinyness.

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RotaryBri



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 465
Location: Warwick

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welder,

Will Daddies sauce still work since Heinz moved production of it (HP sauce as well) from Brum to Holland?
_________________
Keep Torqueing,

RotaryBri

1976 NSU Ro80
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RotaryBri wrote:
Welder,

Will Daddies sauce still work since Heinz moved production of it (HP sauce as well) from Brum to Holland?


It worked a treat, Bri.

So, that's the keyfob refurbed. Better move on to bigger things

I bought a rather nice black leather dog collar from the local pet shop today. That's the spare wheel retaining strap sorted, then.

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dog collar now fitted and spare wheel retained, with a certain amount of poshness.

In fitting new collar/strap I had to remove the rear seat and I realised that not only was the blue leather grubby but it held all the flexibility and suppleness of a Kellogs Cornflakes box. A rummage unearthed some leather cleaner/conditioner and I have to say that, after several applications of the stuff, I'm pleased and surprised with the results. Front seats next........

I've bought a pair of universal seat runners off eBay and shall have a go at making them fit tomorrow. Dimensionally they're very close to the originals which got lost/stolen so should be ok.

A bit of a bonus, earlier today. I decided to remove the drain plug from the bottom of the fuel tank to see how many small dead animals would fall out. Instead, petrol! Quite a lot of it. The fuel gauge has never worked so I just used to put petrol in it whenever I drove it, usually more than I'd use, so it was seldom low on fuel. No signs of rust or marsupials in the outflow so I'll just blow the system through with an air line, from pump connection to tank. Tomorrow. Possibly.

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New seat runners fitted today and work perfectly. They're invisible when installed so I won't feel bad about using modern bits. Even managed to reuse the original knob on the release catch.

While rear seat was out I decided to have a mess with the rear window roller blind which had never worked in my 30 years of ownership. Now it does. Very Happy

Interior has been vacced (?) and all leather is now clean, conditioned and becoming far more supple.

Will bring the portable air-compressor home from work tomorrow and blow-through the fuel supply lines and try to remove the 20 years worth of spiders webs from beneath the car. Will also bring some diesel to pour down the spark plug holes as the light oil isn't doing a fat lot of good. Fingers crossed, Rick. Smile

Still need a battery as old one is scrap. I've no idea wether or not the electric fuel pump is functioning without a battery on the car, although I have new contacts etc should they be needed. Also have a top-end gasket set for the engine, although I'm still hoping that I won't need it. Rolling Eyes

Date for Son's nuptials has been set for 14th July so I have a specific to aim for. No Church after all, they're having a Civil Wedding and the chosen venue is less than 2 miles from here. Result!

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PAUL BEAUMONT



Joined: 27 Nov 2007
Posts: 1281
Location: Barnsley S. Yorks

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Assuming your engine is still stuck, Rick's comment is well worth considering. I have found, over the years, that engines more often sieze in the valves than in the bores especially if they have been stored reasonably well, as yours seems to have been. Another trick worth trying is to attempt to turn it backwards not forwards. You may need to do this withe something like a screwdriver in the starter ring gear.
Good luck!!

Paul
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
welder



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Location: North Warwickshire

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PAUL BEAUMONT wrote:
Assuming your engine is still stuck, Rick's comment is well worth considering. I have found, over the years, that engines more often sieze in the valves than in the bores especially if they have been stored reasonably well, as yours seems to have been. Another trick worth trying is to attempt to turn it backwards not forwards. You may need to do this withe something like a screwdriver in the starter ring gear.
Good luck!!

Paul


Paul, you and I must have a psychic link. Last night I made a start on removing the starter motor for this specific purpose. I realised that the leverage/pressure applied will have a greater effect on the crankshaft at this increased working radius.

I have a small pinch bar which may well be ok for this.

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration. Forum Index -> All our old cars, vans, lorries etc All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page 1, 2, 3 ... 9, 10, 11  Next
Page 1 of 11

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
OCC Merch link
Forum T&C


php BB powered © php BB Grp.