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The most spectacular restoration I have seen?
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Ellis



Joined: 07 Mar 2011
Posts: 1382
Location: Betws y Coed, North Wales

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2018 7:48 pm    Post subject: The most spectacular restoration I have seen? Reply with quote

Over the years I have seen some beautifully restored cars which have included a Morris Minor"Low Light" tourer, a Wolseley 1500 which was like a brand new car and I have also examined a Vicarage Jaguar Mark 2 3.8 litre which was spectacular if a little artificial. A home restored Wolseley Hornet Mark 2 also ranks high.

I was on Anglesey today and saw a 1968 Ford Cortina Mark 2 1600 GT which surpassed them all. The owner asked for the registration number to be obscured.
Have a look at these photographs and judge for yourselves :









The owner is a shy individual who did not wish to appear on camera but he has spent an absolute fortune and hundreds of hours creating this masterpiece. The original Kent engine was beyond repair so he paid a well known engine rebuilding concern to create a Zetec engined former Ford Focus engine breathing through twin Webbers (40s - I think).

I could add lots more photos but I think the above are enough.

The one question I asked myself is whether this is as perfect example of a Mark 2 Cortina 1600 Gt that can be seen anywhere or does it deviate just a shade too far from originality. By the way, it is spectacularly powerful capable of revving to 7000 rpm + but is restricted to 5000 "until it's run in properly".

What do you think?

Edit : I was given the telephone number this evening of the owner of a 1970 Aubergine Ford Cortina 1600E who has decided to sell after 12 years and fancies a change to something else.
I think I am going to have exercise a lot of self control. I just about managed to resist an early 1968 Saluki Bronze example a few years ago. The car was sold to a gentleman from Dublin and I was quite relieved.
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7gzr



Joined: 16 Aug 2018
Posts: 14
Location: 'B' road Heaven - Wild Wales

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It makes sense to use a modernish engine -Zetec Cool in a well used classic, the original X flow is in reality a Boat anchor which uses waay too much fuel for Me, Zetec on other hand probably does +50% more MPG and of course gives probably twice the power.
I've seen many old fords with zetecs fitted especially MK 1 & 2 Escorts - IMO owners are to be applauded for moving with the times [Literally]!!
IMO opinion it's spoilt by the cheap replica alloys - it would look far more menacing with 'Lotus' steels
As for the body panels well its hard to judge from photo's But IMO far too much emphasis is place on SHiny paintwork - WHY?? Major culprit in this are modern paints which are too Shiny - an aquaintance has recently finished restoring a Lee Francis he's done a great job and ruined the whole thing by using modern paint?:
Provided the body is solid [No Rust] Personally I'd prefer to see some Patina relative to age of vehicle - If it looks like NEW then IMO it's a Krap restoration - I'm sure most will disagree with this, but in the end its up to the cars owner to have his car -'HIS WAY' - Bollox to what others think Very Happy :
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badhuis



Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 1390
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is pretty easy to find negatives. I am sure the Ford owner has put in much work in the restoration and as such should be complimented. However for a real good restoration I would expect it to be original, or as original. Not parts be replaced by modern stuff. Sure modern things are much better / economical / faster etc etc but that is besides the point of a restoration of a car.

It is probably much easier to buy new modern wheels, any restoration gets extra points in my opinion if they took the trouble of restoring the original steel wheels with correct hubcaps. The same for the seats, I would have applauded a restore of the original vinyl seats. Again for the engine. It might be a worse specification compared to a modern Zetec, but please buy a modern car if you are into that. That said, each to their own and if anyone wants to put a modern engine in their car then so be it.

So, this car would not be high on my list of perfect restored cars, sorry.
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Rick
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Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

badhuis wrote:
It is pretty easy to find negatives. I am sure the Ford owner has put in much work in the restoration and as such should be complimented. However for a real good restoration I would expect it to be original, or as original. Not parts be replaced by modern stuff. Sure modern things are much better / economical / faster etc etc but that is besides the point of a restoration of a car.

It is probably much easier to buy new modern wheels, any restoration gets extra points in my opinion if they took the trouble of restoring the original steel wheels with correct hubcaps. The same for the seats, I would have applauded a restore of the original vinyl seats. Again for the engine. It might be a worse specification compared to a modern Zetec, but please buy a modern car if you are into that. That said, each to their own and if anyone wants to put a modern engine in their car then so be it.

So, this car would not be high on my list of perfect restored cars, sorry.


It appears to be in great condition, and it's another car saved so thumbs up there, but I do tend to agree with badhuis' comments with regards to restoration, as opposed to "resto-mod" or whatever the term is for upgraded, rebuilt, old cars.

Each to their own though, after all not everyone interested in Minors for example would want mine with its later engine instead of the old sv unit (although I didn't do the swap myself).

RJ
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7gzr



Joined: 16 Aug 2018
Posts: 14
Location: 'B' road Heaven - Wild Wales

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good thing about a modern engine and 5 speed gearbox fitted into any classic is that No-one can tell they are there, unless of course you have the bonnet or your big mouth open bragging to everyone look at me Very Happy
Compare that to the cheapo alloys fitted to the Cortina and the Modern red paint used on it, which everyone can see at all times. It just looks Wrong IMO. and totally negates everything else the restorer has done on the car. Clearly the owner wants Shiny modern paintwork, and cheap replica Alloys Evil or Very Mad
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Ellis



Joined: 07 Mar 2011
Posts: 1382
Location: Betws y Coed, North Wales

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baduis does have a valid point on the updates but I had the opportunity to have a close look at the car and it was, quite frankly, magnificent.

The panel gaps were perfect and the quality of the paintwork was the equal of the best that I have seen.
I suspect that it was not the original Dragoon Red but looked to me to be a brighter shade, possibly Venetian Red which was a popular colour in Mark 2 Ford Escorts.

I know that readers will have their own opinions on the car but, my word, I would have been proud to own it.

I suspect that the costs involved were five figure.
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BigJohn



Joined: 01 Jan 2011
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Location: Wem, Shropshire

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

His car, his rules. I like it, but I also like a tuned crossflow. Keeping it OldSkool!
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
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Location: Derby

PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, but to my eyes, Cortinas are just so much grey porridge. Iv'e seen 'em come and Iv'e seen 'em go. This one has been restored but I really can't get excited unless it is a genuine Lotus Cortina - and they have always been special.
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ukdave2002



Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 4100
Location: South Cheshire

PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I remember being at a show where someone had rebuilt a Viva to "concours" standard, he had a small piece of wood machined to the same thickness as the door gaps in order that he could demonstrate that they were all equal... an old chap piped up; "thats not original....they were never equal when they left the factory" Embarassed

Last edited by ukdave2002 on Sat Sep 01, 2018 6:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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lowdrag



Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 1585
Location: Le Mans

PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In reply to UKDave I have had many experiences of judging concours, and as a result being harangued by the offended entrant. Concours is a much-abused word and is correctly interpreted as "as it left the factory" not "the prettiest most polished car on display". Having deducted several points one day I was followed by the outraged owner until I snapped and asked him where he got the 1961 air to pump up his tyres. That seemed to shut him up.
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alastairq



Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 1950
Location: East Yorkshire

PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray White wrote:
Sorry, but to my eyes, Cortinas are just so much grey porridge. Iv'e seen 'em come and Iv'e seen 'em go. This one has been restored but I really can't get excited unless it is a genuine Lotus Cortina - and they have always been special.


In my eyes, the same applies to Ford Escorts.

They were run-of-the-mill family cars, no more, no less.
I cannot get excited about the stupidzville prices being asked for basic Escort shells! What is the attraction?
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BigJohn



Joined: 01 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Escorts? A peoples car you could drive your 1100 to work and imagine you were Roger Clark, you could work on one with rudimentary tools, make it corner on rails cheaply, and tune it easily and inexpensively (I'm not talking Twin Cams here, just Xflows). It was the car for all men back in it's day. Now they have a bit of spare cash they want to recreate that feeling. I have just come back from a show with a group of friends, an MGB, a TR6pi, an MG Midget, and 2 Mk1 Escorts. Guess which cars of our group got the most attention? The Escorts, one a standard 1967 model, and my played about with little screamer.
As for run of the mill family car, really? Drive a well sorted one on a B road and try not to grin like an onanistic monkey. I haven't found a small saloon that that is as user friendly, cheap to run and repair, and fun so far.


Last edited by BigJohn on Sun Sep 02, 2018 9:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ellis



Joined: 07 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark One and Mark 2 Ford Escorts and Cortinas were among the most practical and affordable cars of the 1960s and Ford's clever marketing strategy was to create a sense of loss and "must have" in their approach. A sense that you were depriving yourself if you didn't own one.

Although I have owned Fords over the years - a Mark Ford Escort 1600 Sport, a Mark 4 Cortina 2000 Ghia and a Sierra Sapphire Cosworth I must admit that the more desirable models of the 1960s have held more interest for me.
A Ford Escort 1300 Gt, a Mexico, a Twin Cam, RS1600 or in Mark One form was most young men's goals.

Many dislike Fords for whatever reason but the Ford appeal is widespread.

The Mark 2 Cortina GT in an early form such as the subject car was a desirable car, the 1600E in particular if you didn't have the means to afford a Lotus version or willing to put up with their temperemental engines you still had the looks or "kudos" of the up market models

The canny Ford marketing men are still at it with the RS versions of the Focus although they have reached very high new prices.

It's a "Ford Thing" which causes the desirability of it's older models more so than other motor manufacturers.

What many people forget is £ for £ Ford built more desirable models in the 1960s than anybody else.

I have just sold a 1954 Land Rover Series One 86", an early one, for a substantial sum and having been in contact with someone who has a good 1970 Cortina 1600E for sale I will have to exercise restraint.
I may succumb ...........................
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
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Location: Derby

PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Possibly the most comprehensive restoration I have seen is this 1904 French veteran Landaulette. To say it was a mammoth restoration would not be an overstatement. It was found in a derelict and incomplete state and frustratingly everything on the car was unique. As there were no other survivors and the identity of the manufacturer uncertain it was attributed to "Socete Manufacturiere d'Arms, St.Etienne as being the most likely origin.

The coachwork is a unique mixture of varnished wood and leather but having been painstakingly rebuilt, the car suffered a catastrophic accident when the trailer on which it was travelling was clipped and overturned. Needless to say it all had to be redone.

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badhuis



Joined: 20 Aug 2008
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Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray White wrote:
Sorry, but to my eyes, Cortinas are just so much grey porridge.

+1
alastairq wrote:
In my eyes, the same applies to Ford Escorts.
They were run-of-the-mill family cars, no more, no less.
I cannot get excited about the stupidzville prices being asked for basic Escort shells! What is the attraction?

+ 2
BigJohn wrote:
I haven't found a small saloon that that is as user friendly, cheap to run and repair, and fun so far.

Hillman Imp and Triumph Dolomite seems good examples. They are also much more stylish. My opinion of course, but I fail to see the attraction of fast mundane Fords.
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