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[split] Old Range Rovers and rusty Discos
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 2923
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Norseman wrote:
Ray White wrote:
Since my last post I have read comments made by an expert that the problem of slipping liners only happened when Land Rover went to 3.9 litres. The problems with this engine were so widespread that apparently they produced completely new castings for the 4.0 litre onwards which employed a bottom lip so this would mean that there is no problem with slipping in the 4.6 litre.


I have to disagree Ray, I've been a contributor to Landyzone (forum) for many years & 4.6's do apparently slip liners. When my 3.9 did just this in 2002 I made extensive enquiries & at that time there were main dealers with P38's lined up awaiting attention for what was THEN considered to be head gasket problems as the cracked block/liner problem was not common knowledge. Many of these engines were in trouble with mileages as low as 20k from new & still under warranty.


If you read on I have gone on to say what you are saying. They can all slip.

In what is probably poetic justice for tempting providence yesterday I noticed that the water level has dropped again in my car. No sign of external leaks so it could be the cracke block/ slip problem. I will check the plugs today and do a compression test. A replacement engine with top hat liners is about 2000 exchange.
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Norseman



Joined: 09 Jan 2019
Posts: 70
Location: Essex UK

PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you read on I have gone on to say what you are saying. They can all slip.

In what is probably poetic justice for tempting providence yesterday I noticed that the water level has dropped again in my car. No sign of external leaks so it could be the cracke block/ slip problem. I will check the plugs today and do a compression test. A replacement engine with top hat liners is about 2000 exchange.[/quote]

I do hope you don't have the dreaded liner problem, but I can point you towards a diagnosis. If you suspect a problem remove the plugs & look for one that appears to have been steam cleaned. If you have a moving liner it will be indicated by a metallic TAP at crankshaft speed (which is twice that of valve gear) & will not be audible when the engine is cold, but will as it starts to warm, up or at least when at running temperature. You could do a HC sniff test to check for head gasket problems, but this test is not always conclusive.
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1987 classic Range Rover Vouge.

A great many models have served me well since the 'sixties, all of them old & some even older than me.
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 2923
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did a sniff test today and it's fine. The coolant level has remained stable and I now think I must have had air in the system. The engine is completely rattle free and runs very sweetly.

So I am a happy bunny... for now.

(Just watch life throw another curved ball! Laughing)
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Norseman



Joined: 09 Jan 2019
Posts: 70
Location: Essex UK

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to hear that Ray, hope all remains well with it Smile
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1987 classic Range Rover Vouge.

A great many models have served me well since the 'sixties, all of them old & some even older than me.
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 2923
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Norseman. Very Happy
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Rick
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Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 20426
Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welllll I think my V8 Disco has finally breathed its last, with me at any rate.

Driving out early yesterday it decided to cook itself and expire in a cloud of steam, this after just spending the week before on all new PAS pipes and cooler, plus fitting a replacement a/c compressor.

I had needed to top up the coolant on a couple of occasions recently, so the signs of impending failure were present I suppose. I can't face having to have the top end rebuilt again, after a similar performance a couple of years back that resulted in a top-end rebuild, new rad and so on.

This latest disaster, coupled with other sizeable work that I can see being necessary in the not-too-distant future, means that it's time to halt any further investment in the old crate. When it was working, it went and drove well and I'd happily have run it for years to come, but the deterioration evident in the body and chassis in various places, coupled with this latest performance, means it's time to find something else - and not anything from L-R, once bitten etc etc.

Shame, but time for it to go, someone may do it up, or at least use it for spares on another example. The top-hat liner engine was beautifully quiet in operation, so hopefully someone will pull it apart and fix it, even if the rest has had it.

RJ
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Various 1920s-1960s - Austin, Morris, Commer, Dodge etc.
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 2923
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a rotten bit of luck Rick - after you have spent out sizeable sums on it.

Have you done a sniff test?
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Rick
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Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray White wrote:
That's a rotten bit of luck Rick - after you have spent out sizeable sums on it.

Have you done a sniff test?


No it always ran fine until the moment it went pop.

RJ
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
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Location: Derby

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what has happened, exactly? I am keeping my fingers crossed that my P38 doesn't give up the ghost in the same way. Shocked
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Rick
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Joined: 27 Apr 2005
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Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray White wrote:
So what has happened, exactly? I am keeping my fingers crossed that my P38 doesn't give up the ghost in the same way. Shocked


I was driving in the dark, nothing obviously amiss, then spotted the temp gauge heading northwards. Bearing in mind that I'd checked the coolant level the day before, and had driven it after that.

By the time I could pull over safely it was into the red, and steam from under the bonnet & out of the back. I've not investigated it any more, I let it cool down, added water so that I could limp to a quieter side road. Let it cool down again, added water, then continued slowly until I could park it at a friend's nearby garage. I've not looked at it since.

What exactly happened I'm not sure, but based on last time, the loss of water (wherever it went) combined with the temp shooting up will have done for the head gaskets, either now or in the near future. Last time, I could continue using the car for some time once the burst pipework had been replaced, but in the end it had to go in for the top to come off the engine, so inevitably it'll need doing again.

The engine is a re-con unit, converted to top hat liners. Being re-con I assume the heads were skimmed as part of that. Then I had them skimmed again. How many times you can get away with skimming them I don't know, but I'm not going down that avenue. I'm already researching a replacement.

RJ
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
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Location: Derby

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you had smoke (probably water vapour) coming out of the exhaust I would also tend to go with head gasket failure. I expect it was caused by a 'pulled' stud fracture but it's academic now.

Best of luck with your search for a replacement. Wink
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Rick
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Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 20426
Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray White wrote:
If you had smoke (probably water vapour) coming out of the exhaust I would also tend to go with head gasket failure. I expect it was caused by a 'pulled' stud fracture but it's academic now.

Best of luck with your search for a replacement. Wink


It has all the hallmarks of HG failure (second time I've seen it after all on this engine), the symptoms were also identical to when the 4.4 engine in dad's old 7-Series BM went up in steam - with a dropped liner in his case.

RJ
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Various 1920s-1960s - Austin, Morris, Commer, Dodge etc.
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emmerson



Joined: 30 Sep 2008
Posts: 1194
Location: South East Wales

PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's sad Rick, doubly so because I hate to see a V8 in trouble, and also because I also hate to lose another LR owner!
Contrary to your troubles, I've just had a call to say that my long-awaited Discovery series 1 is now ready for collection after its comprehensive overhaul. Its been six months since I parted with my much-loved LSE RR, and I'm really looking forward to collecting the "new" car at the weekend.
After 26 years of classic RR ownership, the Disco has a hard task ahead! I've got a couple of weeks to get it into shape for what I want, ie the rear seats out and the space converted to house my sheepdog for traveling, and the boot space fitted to take Herself's mobility scooter, then a short tow to take the Royale classic caravan to a rally in the Forest of Dean before our couple of months in Europe, including the European Classic Caravan Rally in Belgium.
Further bulletins to follow!
Wink
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Rick
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Location: Cheshire

PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been given the number for someone who might be interested in tackling its woes, so it could live on. I'd like to think it will. When it was all (well, mostly) working, it was excellent to drive.

RJ
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Rick (OCC Admin)
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emmerson



Joined: 30 Sep 2008
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Location: South East Wales

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rick wrote:
I've been given the number for someone who might be interested in tackling its woes, so it could live on. I'd like to think it will. When it was all (well, mostly) working, it was excellent to drive.

RJ


If that one fails try Armson a e in Syston, Leicester. A long way from you I know, but this guy has V8s for breakfast. 01163 193251.
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