classic car forum header
Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
Register     Posting Photographs     Privacy     F/book OCC Facebook     OCC on Patreon

1952 Morris Minor Series MM saloon
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration. Forum Index -> All our old cars, vans, lorries etc
Author Message
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:35 am    Post subject: 1952 Morris Minor Series MM saloon Reply with quote

Morning folks,

For some time I'd been pondering about getting a "regular user classic" that was presentable enough to not be embarrassing, but not so mint that it couldn't be used whenever the mood took me. Also it wouldn't have to be too pricey, and have a good spares backup.

The field was narrowed down to the 1950s, with cars such as OHV Minxes, Standards, and various BMC products all being on my radar.

I wasn't looking for a Minor in particular, but their (relative) ease of ownership was a major plus factor when considering a characterful car from the 1950s. A Series II split-screen, maybe with an engine upgrade, seemed to offer the ideal mix of age, spares support and usability. Plus dad's taken on the resurrection of a Moggy 1000, so having a pair of Minors in the fold would be fun.

This MM appeared in an online advertisement, one of the photos from it is shown below - benefiting from a "bucket of water prep job" immediately before taking the photos Smile



I hadn't really considered the MM version, but the (to me) more attractive interior, was a plus point, and this example being a four-door ticked the practicality box. I liked the dark blue colour, and the more I read about it, the more it appealed. It has had a conversion from the original sidevalve engine, to a 1098cc engine & gearbox from a late Moggy 1000. So not a car for the purist, but it should make it a lot more usable, even though the back axle ratio will be the original.

It was extensively restored in about 1990/1991, used for 12 months, then parked up in a dry garage where it remained. It was then sold, and the new owner proceeded to do nothing with it, just leaving it on his driveway. He then advertised it, which is when I got to hear of it.

It looked good in the photos (don't they all), so a visit was arranged to see it in the metal.




The bodywork is in the main very good, there are a couple of bubbles here and there, but very little really, and a few patches of paint reaction if you look closely. But overall its appearance, even with 12 months of grime on it from being parked in the open, was good.

If anything the underside is even better. A few localised repairs have been made underneath, presumably 25 years ago, and they still look fine, with unusually neat lines of weld - probably the tidiest welds I've seen. The common grot-spots, such as the floors, crossmember, spring hangers, sills, front "chassis" legs etc, are all A1. It just needs some oil or similar spraying around to keep it that way.

There are a few light scratches to the paintwork here and there - possibly as a result of cats using it as a ski slope - but a good polish will minimise their impact, and improve its appearance yet further.

The interior is very smart, having been re-trimmed to a good standard, with still-presentable seats, door trims, and a replaced wool cloth headlining. It just needs some detail cleaning and polishing.



Its A-Series engine seems to run well. The only negatives are the brakes, which are sticking on on two or three corners, due to standing. "Still, Minor parts are easy to find aren't they?" I told myself, so bought it - after a few negotiations.

The chrome screen surrounds are with it, but were removed before bringing it home, as they were a loose fit in the repro rubber seals.



The "to do" list on purchase included the following:

- free up the footbrake and adjust/renew parts as required
- drain and re-connect the fuel tank
- adjust handbrake
- attend to a couple of electrical jobs (eg charging)
- source tyres



Predictably enough, virtually all the wheel cylinders were stuck. It was at about this time that I began to appreciate that many MM parts are very different to the Series II and Minor 1000s, including the brakes. Replacement wheel cylinders are made from unobtainium, while the back axle - and the gubbins bolted to it - is also completely different.

I've sourced a pair of 7" front backplates from a later 948cc car, this will enable me to convert to cylinders from later Minors, which are ten-a-penny. A conversion kit is available, which incorporates new shoes, cylinders, pipes, and all the fiddly fittings required to do the swap, once backplates have been located - which was surprisingly difficult actually.

The rear drums are held on with a large, castellated, nut, on the end of the half-shaft. The wheels bolt to the drums, unlike later cars which have wheels held by nuts. The nearside castle nut wouldn't budge, despite hours spent with heat, hammers, long lengths of tube, and so on. The net result is that I need to find a replacement nut. Following on from the issue of sourcing wheel cylinders, I was again reminded that MM parts are much trickier to source than for later variants. Hmmmm - does anyone have a spare castle nut?

More to follow ....

RJ
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
peter scott



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7113
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Rick,

It looks in nice condition. The dash on the MM is much nicer than that on the later cars.

I wonder if the brake cylinders are actually the same as those on a Wolseley 6/80 that I've just replaced?

I think the TR2 also uses these.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=morris+minor+mm+brake+cylinder&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xwolseley+6%2F80+brake+cylinder.TRS0&_nkw=wolseley+6%2F80+brake+cylinder&_sacat=0

Peter
_________________
http://www.nostalgiatech.co.uk
1939 SS Jaguar 2 1/2 litre saloon
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
ukdave2002



Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 4100
Location: South Cheshire

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The rear axle is very similar to the Z van:



Rear drums and halfshafts are rare, so avoid wheelspin starts!! the rear brakes are the same as the later Minors, however originally they had 7/8" rear cylinders; these changed to 3/4" on later cars. If you are changing the fronts to a later spec, it might be prudent to change the rear cylinders to the smaller diameter? I'm sure the MM experts will advise.

Dave
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Churchill Johnson



Joined: 11 Jan 2011
Posts: 359
Location: Rayleigh Essex

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need a 6 leg puller, that same idea was on some of the old vauxhall's which i think used 5.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Keith D



Joined: 16 Oct 2008
Posts: 1127
Location: Upper Swan, Western Australia

PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rick, Can't you get the wheel cylinders re-sleeved with stainless steel liners for a moderate price?

Keith
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keith D wrote:
Rick, Can't you get the wheel cylinders re-sleeved with stainless steel liners for a moderate price?

Keith


Yes that was an option, I've not looked into the cost of re-sleeving but upgrading to the later backplates and cylinders, with the resulting ease of finding replacements if ever they're needed, swung me, plus the cost was minimal of doing this. I'll be able to retain the original drums, so everything will still look correct, it'll just be the internals that differ slightly.

A discussion on the MMOC forum has led to an interesting discovery. My factory manual for the MM suggests that the n/s/r hub/drum nut has a lefthand thread, whereas manuals belonging to other MM owners says that both sides have the usual righthand thread.

I need to find a replacement castellated nut, suitable for the MM version, if anyone can help?

RJ
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Box of goodies arrived this morning, just one more to come then I can get on with more spannering.

RJ
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PAUL BEAUMONT



Joined: 27 Nov 2007
Posts: 1281
Location: Barnsley S. Yorks

PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know you have solved the problem Rick, but did you talk to Paul Hunt at Powertrack? I find he is pretty good with thing made of unobtainium! (No connection other than as a customer)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't pursue the idea of re-sleeving (which I had to do on the Dodge iirc), with later cylinders being so cheap it didn't seem worth it really.

Today saw the brake overhaul commence. I bought a pair of later backplates from a gent who's retiring from the Morris spares scene, and a conversion set (cylinders/shoes/pipes/flexis/fittings etc).

I made a start swapping over the n/s/f brakes, but came to a halt when I spotted that the supplied metal pipes (the ones that bridge across the two cylinders on each side) were a) a little short, and b) appear to have the incorrect unions on them. One end is correct, the other isn't, so I'll need to give them a bell on Monday.

It shouldn't slow me down, as I can dismantle and fit most of the other parts to the o/s/f tomorrow, plus I've new TREs to fit also.

RJ
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop


Last edited by Rick on Sun Feb 28, 2016 10:05 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ukdave2002



Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 4100
Location: South Cheshire

PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rick wrote:
I didn't pursue the idea of re-sleeving (which I had to do on the Dodge iirc), with later cylinders being so cheap it didn't seem worth it really.

Today saw the brake overhaul commence. I bought a pair of later backplates from a gent who's retiring from the Morris spares scene, and a conversion set (cylinders/shoes/pipes/flexis/fittings etc).

I made a start swapping over the n/s/f brakes, but came to a halt when I spotted that the supplied metal pipes (the ones that bridge across the two cylinders on each side) were a) a little short, and b) appear to have the incorrect unions on them. One end is correct, the other isn't, so I'll need to give them a bell on Monday.

It shouldn't slow me down, as I can dismantle and fit most of the other parts to the o/s/f tomorrow, plus I've new TREs to fit also.

RJ
hi Rick, just mak sure you have the correct/ balanced cylinder dimensions.

Dave
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22429
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will do.

Popped over to dad's today, in part to have a look at the layout of the pipework behind the front backplate on his car. While his Moggy 1000 - due to hit the road sometime soon - is on 8" rather than 7" front brakes, it was handy to see how the cross pipe between the two wheel cylinders is arranged.



Today I removed the o/s/f backplate and cylinders on mine, and replaced both track rod ends. I wish that whoever assembled it 25 years ago had heard of copper grease, it'd have made my life a whole lot easier. Every thread put up a fight.

RJ
_________________
Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
norustplease



Joined: 11 Apr 2011
Posts: 779
Location: Lancashire

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It looks like a nice buy, these little cars are a treat to drive given their age and in some respects, were years ahead of their time, compared to contemporary offerings. I am sure that you will enjoy using it.
I was going to warn you that the earlier versions have a lot of detail differences from the later 1000, and to be careful with part buying, but you have sussed that out already. Most of the specialist suppliers should be able to sort things out for you.

When I parted with my first car back in the early 1970's, a green 2 door 1000 saloon, I never thought that one day almost 40 odd years later, I would seek to cherish one of these little cars.

Volvo MOT on Tuesday, fingers crossed!
_________________
1953 Citroen Traction
1964 Volvo PV544
1957 Austin A55 Mk 1
Boring Tucson SUV
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
norustplease



Joined: 11 Apr 2011
Posts: 779
Location: Lancashire

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Incidentally, isn't this a Series 11 rather than an MM?
I do have an original BMC workshop manual, so feel free to shout out if you have any queries
_________________
1953 Citroen Traction
1964 Volvo PV544
1957 Austin A55 Mk 1
Boring Tucson SUV
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
goneps



Joined: 18 Jun 2013
Posts: 601
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

norustplease wrote:
Incidentally, isn't this a Series 11 rather than an MM?

Yes. MM Minors had the side-valve USHM2 and USHM3 Morris engines, up to 1953 I believe. Often referred to as "low-light", a reference to the position of the headlamps
either side of the grille.

Possibly the confusion comes about because "MM" is a convenient abbreviation for "Morris Minor". And not to be confused with the pre-war OHC and SV cars of the same name,
of course.

Richard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
peter scott



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7113
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the MM desigation was used for all the post war side valve Minors regardless of headlamp position. The Series II cars all had the A series 803 cc engine.

Peter
_________________
http://www.nostalgiatech.co.uk
1939 SS Jaguar 2 1/2 litre saloon
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration. Forum Index -> All our old cars, vans, lorries etc All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next
Page 1 of 10

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
OCC Merch link
Forum T&C


php BB powered © php BB Grp.