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peter scott



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 6438
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was 55 years ago so my memory might have some holes in it. I think my charging problem was with the control box. I bought a scrap Isetta for the engine and I think I swapped the control boxes to sort the problem.

Peter
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MVPeters



Joined: 28 Aug 2008
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Location: Northern MA, USA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a camping holiday in Wales some years ago, in a BMW Isetta, we stopped at a farm for the night.
The usual charge was 1/- but the farmer said as we only had 3 wheels it would be 9d.
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Penman



Joined: 23 Nov 2007
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Location: Lancashire

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi
MVPeters wrote:
On a camping holiday in Wales some years ago, in a BMW Isetta, we stopped at a farm for the night.
The usual charge was 1/- but the farmer said as we only had 3 wheels it would be 9d.


He obviously didn't check round the back.
Quote:
The first prototypes had one wheel at the rear, but having a single rear wheel made the car prone to roll-overs, so the rear wheel layout was changed to two wheels set 48 cm (19 in) apart from each other. This narrow track eliminated the need for a differential.

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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 3993
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have had both 3 and 4 wheel versions and neither were what you could call stable. I thought the ones assembled at Brighton were all three wheelers. The four wheelers were taxed as a car and you required a car license to drive one.

The three wheelers were taxed less and you could drive them on a motorcycle license.

There is a myth that they had no reverse gear and if they did it had to be blanked off. Both my Isettas had a reverse gear ( if you could find it!) and no blanking off was necessary.
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alanb



Joined: 10 Sep 2012
Posts: 507
Location: Berkshire.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All the early isettas were 4 wheel it was only the Brighton built cars made after 1957 that had 3 wheels to take advantage of the tax regulation’s
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MVPeters



Joined: 28 Aug 2008
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Location: Northern MA, USA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MVPeters wrote:
On a camping holiday in Wales some years ago, in a BMW Isetta, we stopped at a farm for the night.
The usual charge was 1/- but the farmer said as we only had 3 wheels it would be 9d.


Sorry, it must have been a Heinkel.
I just remember the 9d.
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 3993
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MVPeters wrote:
MVPeters wrote:
On a camping holiday in Wales some years ago, in a BMW Isetta, we stopped at a farm for the night.
The usual charge was 1/- but the farmer said as we only had 3 wheels it would be 9d.


Sorry, it must have been a Heinkel.
I just remember the 9d.


Pretty little cars; Heinkel. A true "Bubble" car. Only 200cc I seem to remember.
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peter scott



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 6438
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Messerschmitt had no reverse gear. You stopped the two stroke engine and restarted it backwards. This gave the possibility to use all the gears for travelling backwards even up to full speed if you were brave (or foolhardy) enough!

Peter
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 3993
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

peter scott wrote:
The Messerschmitt had no reverse gear. You stopped the two stroke engine and restarted it backwards. This gave the possibility to use all the gears for travelling backwards even up to full speed if you were brave (or foolhardy) enough!

Peter


They also produced a 4 wheel car - the TG Tiger.

Quite a performer by all accounts.
https://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/messerschmitt-tg500-tiger-ar59157.html
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peter scott



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 6438
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray, I see in you link for the KR500 it describes the transmission as:
4 speed plus reverse transmission, and differential

I wonder if they moved to this more conventional arrangement for the 500?

Peter
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
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Location: Derby

PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

peter scott wrote:
Ray, I see in you link for the KR500 it describes the transmission as:
4 speed plus reverse transmission, and differential

I wonder if they moved to this more conventional arrangement for the 500?

Peter


The Tiger had a transaxle. I didn't even know the 4 wheel version of Fritz Fend's design even existed until many years after my 'bubble' car era. I understand they fetch a pretty penny these days.
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lowdrag



Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 1393
Location: Le Mans

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray White wrote:
peter scott wrote:
Ray, I see in you link for the KR500 it describes the transmission as:
4 speed plus reverse transmission, and differential

I wonder if they moved to this more conventional arrangement for the 500?

Peter


The Tiger had a transaxle. I didn't even know the 4 wheel version of Fritz Fend's design even existed until many years after my 'bubble' car era. I understand they fetch a pretty penny these days.


Were I to say dearer than an E-type it might surprise you. Not a Tiger, but the more prosaic models are coming up for sale in October and you can see the estimates here:-

https://rmsothebys.com/en/home/lots/el20#?SortBy=Default&SearchTerm=messerschmidt&Category=All%20Categories&IncludeWithdrawnLots&Auction=EL20&OfferStatus=All%20availability&AuctionYear=&Model=Model&Make=Make&FeaturedOnly=false&StillForSaleOnly=false&Collection=All%20Lots&WithoutReserveOnly=false&Day=All%20Days&CategoryTag=All%20Categories&TimedOnly=false&OneHubLinkOnly=false&page=1&pageSize=40

They don't come on the market often, but here was one sold in 2015:-


https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/22792/lot/106/

£138,000 even then
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peter scott



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 6438
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sheer madness!

Peter Shocked
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Ray White



Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 3993
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the real world you are at risk on the roads in a small car like an Austin Seven. To drive something as small and in particular as low as a Messerschmitt you would be terribly vulnerable.

I once went in a Kabinenroller as a passenger. It was quite good fun - but I imagine the novelty would wear off.
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Rick
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 21546
Location: UK

PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rick wrote:
The A40 was the first car I ever drove on the road as my own car, after passing my test in it, late 1987. But KED 453F was the first car I owned albeit as a wreck to begin with. It was donated to me in many many pieces in about 1986/7 but it was only in 1989 that it hit the road. It's still around and I last heard from the current owner a few years back, I think it must have been rebuilt at least three times in all so far.



RJ


Coincidentally I heard from the present owner yesterday, who is thinking of selling KED. In some respects it'd be nice to own it again but maybe these things should be left to the rose-tinted memories of old?

RJ
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