Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.

[garyjpaterson]

Well, no good news... yet.

Batteries arrived, so I spent all evening with the Anglia. I'll go through what I've done so far, just in case I've missed something that I haven't spotted.

Found the keys, opened the boot for the first time in probably 20 years to find a tiny bit of motorbike oil, and a coke bottle with water in it! Also some very 80's childs jacket, must have been my sisters. Also have a spare which is nice, hope it holds air as the front/drivers side doesn't.



First thing is first, I drained the tank. Plug came out fairly easily, but the inside of the plug was rusted over, so had to punch through it before the (little amount) of fuel came out. I've never smelled such horrible petrol in my life! The whole shed absolutely stinks now! I chucked a couple of litres of fresh petrol in.

Took the plugs out, gave each a once over with a wire brush and checked the gaps, squirt of oil in each chamber too. Tried to clean 'the points' (I'll admit, I'd never heard of this before, I had to google what this meant ), though I'm not convinced I did a good job. I didn't have any emery cloth or wet/dry to hand, and wasn't going in with sand paper, ended up just using isopropyl alcohol to clean the contacts, honestly don't think it did much at all. This will need looking at again I reckon. The distributer looked good to me, not that I know what I'm looking for, but it was all fairly clean looking. Leads seem to make a connection, but I'll have to check later.

Next I took the float chamber out, didn't have any fuel in it but certainly stank of the horrible stuff from the tank. Its not the cleanest looking, not terrible but I wasn't sure about the jets, I didn't touch them for fear of doing something I shouldn't Would probably benefit from a good clean, any suggestions? Leave it to soak in fresh petrol? Anyway, I topped up the chamber with fuel and put it back together.

I then disconnected the fuel line from the pump/filter, tried to blow through to check its free - not a chance. Totally blocked. Tried unblocking with a wire, it was a bit flimsy and could only get a few feet in (the line from the pump to the carb was ok, I checked it too). Filter didn't look too bad, there was some manky old fuel in the pump, tried to get it out and fresh stuff in.

With fuel in the float chamber, I know it makes no difference but it was bugging me that the fuel line was blocked, so I ended up taking the tank out, and managed to properly unblock it from the other side.



At least I know the fuel sender and fuel gauge works (and that the small batteries are providing some current)!

With everything back together (I topped up the radiator too, and yes the top hose also leaks ), it was time to prime then try to start. It does feel like there was more compression, not massive amounts but then I still don't know how much to expect! Anyway I primed with choke on, then connected the battery, turned the key and tried cranking; well, not much of anything happened. No signs of life, no different than cranking with the ignition off.

I did wonder if the battery just wasn't doing anything, or I connected it up wrong, but the fuel gauge works when you turn the key so its not that. I had to come inside at that point, but I'll get out later and try and work out whats going on, suggestions are very welcome!

I suppose its not getting a spark or fuel. I think I'll check for spark first.

Cheers

[Rick]

With the batteries connected, and the ignition switched on, you should find that if you open and close the points (using a screwdriver with an insulated handle!), there'll be a spark jumping across. If there isn't then you'll not get a spark making it to the plugs.

Get a spark at the points first, then make sure it's getting as far as the plugs, and with that done you should be close to getting it to fire up, assuming it's drawing in sufficient fuel.

RJ
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[garyjpaterson]

Good point Rick, I'll get on it later!

[MVPeters]

You might need a battery with a bit more 'oomph' !

Have you had the original big black one re-charged & tested? Your local, friendly, old-fashioned garage should be able to oblige.
_________________
Mike - MVPeters at comcast.net
2002 MINI Cooper 'S'

[garyjpaterson]

[MVPeters]

It's worth a shot.
Use distilled water to just cover the plates & put it on a gentle charge all day. Keep an eye on it.
With any luck you might get enough charge in it to spin the engine over.
_________________
Mike - MVPeters at comcast.net
2002 MINI Cooper 'S'

[Rick]

The white metal bearings really don't want to be running dry for a few seconds if it does fire up, after years of idleness.

It may be worth putting a 12v battery on it, purely to spin the starter in short bursts to get the oil around the inside of the engine. The starter will cope with short bursts of 12v. I'd not normally suggest it, but it would help protect the bearings, just make sure nothing else electrical is "on" at the time.

Pops and Anglias are usually positive earth btw.

The oil in my Moggy's engine looked ok on the dipstick, but when I drained it out it was like water, so I'd be tempted to get that fresh 20/50 in, if not already

RJ
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[garyjpaterson]

Good shout about the oil Rick, there was a fair bit of water when I drained it! Also seems to be a fair amount of sludge in the sump, if I do ever get it running I'll take the sump off and clear it out.

Still at a bit of a loss when it comes to a spark; Am I supposed to be seeing a spark across the points when having it cranked? Because I'm definitely not seeing anything. I do get a small spark when I 'bridge' the 2 points with a screwdriver?

I checked the gap, it was maybe slightly over 12 thousanths, I took it down to 11 (I know its supposed to be 10-12 thou). Took a plug out and held it close to the block while cranking, definitely no sign of a spark there either.

I think fuel is at least moving, as after a fair bit of cranking with choke I was smelling petrol, which is nicer than the vile stuff that I took out the tank yesterday

I attached a 12v battery to give the starter a couple of quick bursts (after the oil change that is), surprised that it worked. Gave it two short bursts, I stopped on the third when I heard more 'enginey' noises instead of just the whirring of the starter (if that makes sense).

And I'll stick the original 6v battery on a gentle charge, see if thats able to spin it over at all tomorrow.

Also I appreciate everyone's patience, must be frustrating watching me be so incompetent!

[Penman]

Hi
It sounds like there is a poor connection somewhere in the circuits.
The condenser and points normally earth through the distributor body to the block. Have you removed the Distributor to check that the mating surfaces are clean.
Are you still using the Ignition switch? There might be a poor connection in that hence the tip to try it with a direct wire from battery to coil.
Is the condenser working correctly ie is there a good metal to metal connection for it;s earth?
Is the coil actually doing it's job of generating a spark? Can you try another one?
_________________
Bristols should always come in pairs.

Any 2 from:-
Straight 6
V8 V10

[Rick]

If by bridging either side of the points you get a spark, but don't across the gap when you flick them open from closed (ign on) with the screwdriver, it suggests that you need to revisit the mating surfaces of the points to clean them up. Fine emery paper will do, you want them to look shiny without pips and/or burnt marks on them ideally.

The fact that you're getting power to them is encouraging.

With the points clean, you should get a spark when you flip the points open with the end of the screwdriver. If the points aren't closed to begin with, turn the engine over slightly, which turns the distributor shaft & cam on which the rotor arm pushes onto, until they are. Once you have this test spark, then yes, when you turn the engine over, you should see the spark jump across the points. After that, check for a spark at the plugs, but only once you have a good spark at the points.

RJ
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[garyjpaterson]

Ah ok, got you now. Just ran out to check properly, no, not a good spark anyway. I seem to get a very very small/faint spark every now and then, but not a good consistent spark, not like when I bridge the points. I think its safe to say the points need a much better clean up.

I'll get some emery paper asap and see where we go from there

Thanks

[roverdriver]

Make sure it is fine emery. I use 'Wet & Dry' paper of about 400 grit. If you use a screwdriver to pen the closed points, then insert the folded paper (folded so it will polish both sides at once) then allow the points to close, but still taking the spring pressure off with the screwdriver, you'll be able to work the paper back and forth to polish the points. Don't just pull the paper out though, open the points the remove the paper. (pulling it out under pressure can allow some of the grit to remain on the points and stop you getting a contact)

Also suggest making sure that the distributor cap is clean and dry. Wipe it out with a dry cloth inside, the wipe the outside, especially around the bosses where the wires are inserted. Also wipe clean the rotor arm as well.

Good luck with it, and remember, no question is silly, and your keenness to tackle the job overcomes any of your feelings of incompetence - we all have to learn things, and there are plenty of people on this wonderful Forum keen to assist you.
_________________
Dane- roverdriver but not a Viking.

[garyjpaterson]

Cheers, thats the plan. I have some rougher sand paper, but after seeing a couple youtube videos I decided to steer clear and get some finer stuff, didn't want to cause any damage.

The distributer cap looked fairly clean on the inside, though I'll give it a clean just to be sure anyway.

[roverdriver]

Gary, while an engine can be coaxed into life with dodgy and worn out points, remember that a points set must be considered a consumable, and therefore burned, worn or poorly aligned units should be replaced as needed.

Looking forward to hearing of progress.
Dane.
_________________
Dane- roverdriver but not a Viking.

[kevin2306]

If this was my car, I would hang fire a little.
why not source some new plugs and points etc and change over (only a few £££s)
with the plugs out, get some oil down the bores and do some cranking with the plugs out, after a bit of cranking, drop the oil and change it for some better stuff (may prevent any damage incurred to an otherwise decent engine?)
For the Carburetor, I have an ultrasonic bath that does a fine job of cleaning them up, 10 mins in some citric based cleaner and hot water followed by some gentle blow through with an airline (or a can of air if you dont have an air line) and I think you would be in a better place and stand more of a chance of getting it running sweet?
sometimes we are in such a rush to hear it running that we risk causing damage?

Kevin