Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.
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aps
Joined: 15 Mar 2013 Posts: 37 Location: aberdeenshire
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Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:30 pm Post subject: changing 6v to 12v |
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help needed please ,ive been advised to change the electrics in a vw camper from 6v to 12v ,so what do i need to change,, and is it of any benefit to change at all ,wayne |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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It's straight forward to complete, but IMHO only worth the effort if you are planning to do much night driving.
Dave |
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ka
Joined: 03 Dec 2007 Posts: 600 Location: Orkney.
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 7:07 am Post subject: |
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I can understand the logic behind the last comment, but there are some excellent 6v halogen headlight bulbs out there. _________________ KA
Better three than four. |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 9:23 am Post subject: |
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ka wrote: | I can understand the logic behind the last comment, but there are some excellent 6v halogen headlight bulbs out there. |
True, but to get any significant improvement they tend to be a higher wattage than original spec bulbs, so can push the dynamo and original wiring to the limit ...or beyond.
Dave |
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Peter_L
Joined: 10 Apr 2008 Posts: 2680 Location: New Brunswick. Canada.
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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The difference in current, Amps, required for (example) 55 Watt bulb on a 6V or 12V system.
Watts / Voltage = Amps
55 W / 6 V = 9.2 Amps
55 W / 12 V = 4.6 Amps (Half the current of 55 Watts at 6 Volt)
Extend that for all the bulbs, fan, radio or whatever and the numbers really add up.
To really see the difference that voltage makes, take for example a 55 Watt bulb on a 240V domestic supply.
55 / 240 = .23 Not quite a 1/4 of 1 Amp.
.... above assumes that the bulbs are appropriate for the voltage, i.e 6volt 12 volt or 240 volt rated bulbs.
Post Script.
Having moved from the UK to Canada, I now live with high amps required for electrical items because of the 110V system. Arghhhh !!! |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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The problem is Peter most people don't do your calculation;
I do a bit with Morris 8's , the standard dynamo is good for about 85W, 90, at a push.....owners upgrade to 35W headlamps, so we now have 70W of headlamps, at least 16W of side and tail; 86W of lighting before we have even considered the demand of the ignition, wiper motor, horn, trafficator's
Oh and did you expect to charge the battery as well
Dave |
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Bitumen Boy
Joined: 26 Jan 2012 Posts: 1735 Location: Above the snow line in old Monmouthshire
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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As for the lights, don't forget that LED technology seems to be coming on in leaps and bounds. It's quite possible that really good 6v headlights - that draw relatively little current - will soon be available, if indeed they aren't already available. However, there are some advantages in changing a 6v vehicle to 12v. Firstly, if you want to charge phones or whatever on the move, then all the off the shelf chargers are for 12v electrical systems. Granted there are probably workarounds to charge such things off a 6v system, but in most cases it's probably going to be easier to do do the 12v conversion! Secondly, batteries. 12v batteries are widely available in a variety of sizes and configurations, and, provided that you're not too fussed about the look of the thing, competition between factors generally means that you can get a good deal within a reasonable distance of home. 6v batteries, on the other hand, are specialist kit these days - you'll be waiting in for a delivery and paying a good bit of money for the privilige, neither the delivery costs or the batteries themselves are going to be exactly cheap. Thirdly, there's jump starting. Given a 12v system you can be jump started if necessary by (or indeed return the favour to) virtually any car on your street or in the supermarket carpark. With 6v, however, you'll be struggling, and in the abscence of a handy slope or willing volunteers to push could easily end up having to phone for assistance, and probably hang around for a good while to boot. If originality is your thing then by all means stick with 6v, but if you want to actually use it then I'd plump for 12v every time. |
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petermeachem
Joined: 23 Sep 2013 Posts: 358 Location: Chichester Sussex
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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You can get 6v led headlamp bulbs. I'm having them, being able to put headlamps on that chuck out some light without flattening the battery is a huge advantage.
My Austin Seven was jump started by a London taxi once. Cranked very quickly! I imagine it was 12v. Everything survived |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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I'd be interested if you can post a link to 6v led headlamps,
I have seen " bright" 6v LEDs , that would be good for sidle lamps, but a headlamp has to focus the light to throw it. I'd imagine any new led headlamp would have to come with its own reflector and lens?
Dave |
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Rick Site Admin
Joined: 27 Apr 2005 Posts: 22447 Location: UK
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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ukdave2002 wrote: | I'd be interested if you can post a link to 6v led headlamps,
I have seen " bright" 6v LEDs , that would be good for sidle lamps, but a headlamp has to focus the light to throw it. I'd imagine any new led headlamp would have to come with its own reflector and lens?
Dave |
LED bulbs have been a talking point in VSCC circles of late. A friend tried them in his vintage motor but didn't much like them for night use, mainly due to the light pattern.
RJ _________________ Rick - Admin
Home:https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk
Videos:https://www.youtube.com/user/oldclassiccarRJ/videos
OCC & classic car merchandise (Austin, Ford ++):
https://www.redbubble.com/people/OldClassicCar/shop |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 9:56 pm Post subject: |
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Rick wrote: | ukdave2002 wrote: | I'd be interested if you can post a link to 6v led headlamps,
I have seen " bright" 6v LEDs , that would be good for sidle lamps, but a headlamp has to focus the light to throw it. I'd imagine any new led headlamp would have to come with its own reflector and lens?
Dave |
LED bulbs have been a talking point in VSCC circles of late. A friend tried them in his vintage motor but didn't much like them for night use, mainly due to the light pattern.
RJ |
I can imagine that; LEDs can be easily substituted for filament bulbs in rear , side and indicators......however I don't believe a straight forward bulb only swap for an led in a headlamp would be effective, as the bulb, reflector and lens are effectively "tuned" . I suspect modern led complete headlamp units are available, but probably wouldn't look right in an old crock!
Dave |
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petermeachem
Joined: 23 Sep 2013 Posts: 358 Location: Chichester Sussex
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:46 am Post subject: |
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petermeachem wrote: | http://www.dynamoregulatorconversions.com/whats-new.php |
That will be interesting to follow how they get on, and refreshing to hear a firm be honest about the challenge. If they can resolve the light throw issue, then their headlamp offer would be great.
Having done a bit of experimenting with LEDs myself I couldn't see how it could be done without changing bot the lens and reflector, but it would be great if it could
Dave |
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petermeachem
Joined: 23 Sep 2013 Posts: 358 Location: Chichester Sussex
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Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 6:43 am Post subject: |
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Did you scroll down and look at the pictures? They look pretty good to me. Driving an Austin Seven in the dark and actually be able to see where you are going would be novel. |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4105 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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petermeachem wrote: | Did you scroll down and look at the pictures? They look pretty good to me. Driving an Austin Seven in the dark and actually be able to see where you are going would be novel. |
Yep, but as they acknowledge its quite easy to make a bright led lamp, which is a huge advantage in its self; to be seen...but it much more difficult to get a beam pattern that illuminates both kerb and distance when simply swapping a filament bulb for an led/s.
My modern only has LED's in the headlamps and its a better system than the previous modern that had HD lamps, but it has clusters of leds that move about on stalks ; had to chuckle what I looked at it; its a mechanical dipping system, just like my 75 year old Morris 8
Dave |
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