Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.

[buzzy bee]

Am I right in saying that Cellulose paint is only going to be available for another year or so? If I am right then if you stock up be sure to keep turning it else it will separate!

Cheers

Dave

[admin]

Yeah we can thank europe for this one!

I was hoping to teach myself celly painting, but now I guess it'll have to be water-based paints that I need to learn. UJ I think is looking into this very subject as we type.. well....sometime anyway

Rick.

[Uncle Joe]

Yes, you are correct, I am looking into this with water based paints. At present, a friend is shipping over some paint surface mail from the US, and when it arrives (any day now) will be driving out to him to observe / help.

Until then, I am trying to research as much info as possible.

UJ

[Uncle Joe]

Trawling the net has brought some information about water based paints, which on the face of things seem positive.

1) Apparently, they are ready to use, and dont need thinners, hardeners, etc. Not even primer is needed!

2) It takes less material to respray a vehicle. Less time is also needed in a heated spray booth. But how many of us has one of them at our disposal?

3) The shelf life is indefinate. This one I dont believe!

4) Obviously, they are more environmentally friendly.

If all goes according to plan, then next week I will be watching a friend spray a car with water based. When this is done, I intend to post my observations. In the meantime, is there anyone out there that would like me to look out for anything in particular when the job is being carried out?

[admin]

I did read somewhere that its essential to have a flow of warm air over the paintwork for it to dry, heat on its own isn't enough. Whether this is right or not I dont know, but be interested to hear how it goes

cheers
Rick

[Uncle Joe]

That one I can answer already.

Airflow is used to speed up the drying time, thats all. Its not really needed. But, as far as I can understand things, there are other minimum requirements.

[Uncle Joe]

After now having seen water based being applied to some test pieces, I have mixed feelings.

Positives: Less material is needed, no need to worry about flash times. Little or no "orange peel." Doesn´t smell much, therefore OK for home use. Air dries OK, if no moisture.

Negatives: Does not like moisture (!). May only be sprayed on lightly. Seems to need a protective coat of clear laquer, not water based!

I dont know what else to say! Any questions?

[admin]

So possibly easier for us newbie sprayers to pick up and get reasonable results with? although maybe less flexible than celly, where seasoned sprayers play around with the ratio of thinners:paint and so on??

Rick

[Uncle Joe]

From what I saw, way easier for Newbies, as long as the coats are light. No messing around with thinners and so on is definately an advantage there. Another thing. In a way, it even looks "old" before polishing!

[admin]

sounds like it could be ok then, I'd prefer a finish that isnt super-shiny anyway for my stuff - too many newly repainted classics look like a boiled sweet I think long live flat paintwork and a feeling of age!

Rick.

[Uncle Joe]

True enough. The trouble with a lot of restorations is that especially the paintwork is over-restored. The point is to make them look like new, and not better than new. Although, this does depend on the car. I personally would not like to see a matt pink ´59 Cadillac, for example!

Sometimes, this extra shine is caused by people using a clear laquer top coat for the extra protection that it gives, and so on, but then dont have the knowledge to make it flatter afterwards.

Whilst on the subject of paint, there is one other thing that does aggravate the h**l out of me. These people that insist that a car is coachpainted, even when it wasn´t originally!

[Castellated nut]

I had not heard that cellulose was to go, but I guessed it was only a matter of time, given the guppy-brains that are in charge of our lives these days!

Respraying a car is one thing (though I'd be surprised to find water-based paints are a viable DIY proposition), but how do we make repairs to existing cellulose paintwork? Assuming we can stock up with a couple of litres of paint (and thinner) for vehicles we own, what is the real-world shelf-life of cellulose?

Sounds to me like the end of civilisation as we know it.

[Uncle Joe]

From what I have already seen, water based paints are a far more viable proposition for home use than cellulose. Repairs should be somewhat easier to carry out as well, as it will not react to the substrate. The fact that to me it seemed a little more dull or flat can only be an advantage.

Though I still have mixed feelings, I think that on balance, the bureaucrats have got it right!

Food for thought. In the early seventies, a friend decided to respray his Minivan Sutherland Green, if I remember correctly. When we bought the paint, he asked specifically for Acrylic, to which the Motor Factor replied " You should use cellulose, acrylic is a thing of the past!"

[admin]

:Castellated nut

Not sure where you're based, this is being introduced in the UK (as part of a Europe-wide thing I think)

Thanks for the info UJ, interesting to hear how the water based option stacks up

Rick

[Uncle Joe]

The funny thing is, in spite of the fact that the introduction of water based paint is supposed to be a European thing, I had not actually heard of it here!

The only reason that we tried it was simply because we usually ship our paint in from the US.

Just to be controversial, (as usual) the same US that didn´t sign the Kyoto treaty. Could it be the fact that they are ahead of Europe in certain areas?