Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.

[clan chieftain]

When you look at the forum index from Austin to Vauxhall they are almost all gone now. Did it all go downhill in the 80s when BL churned out rustbuckets like Allegros, Marinas , Maestros, Montegos . Then there were hardly any Japanese or French cars on the road. Was it the Government or the workforce or the unions that caused the decline. Maybe foreign cars were cheaper. Look at the vans as well..J2,J4, Sherpa and LDV were hardly worldbeaters were they. Look at it now its mostly Japanese and French cars dominating the market and they are good cars. Its the same with small vans like the Berlingo and the Kangoo, both great wee vans. What have we got...nothing.
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The Clan Chieftain

[Ellis]

I agree. Totally.

Twenty years ago, for example, all Post Office delivery vans would have been Ford Escorts, Vauxhall Astras and there were some Austin Maestros and Metros. Not many admittedly.

Today the Post Office vans are Peugeot Blippers or their Citroen equivalent.
Ford Transit Connect is built in Turkey and the Vauxhall Astra van in Germany and Poland.

I don't understand : France still builds Peugeots, Citroen and Renault in quantity. Germany builds VW, Audi, Mercedes, Opel, BMW in ever increasing numbers.

The Ford Transit factory in Southampton is about to close.
Foden, ERF, Scammell, Seddon Atkinson, Bedford or ATV, Leyland, LDV and Ford HGVs have all gone - where to though?

Admittedly Vauxhall Vivaros and their Nissan and Renault versions are built in Luton but what else ?

Have you tried buying a new British made TV?
I gave up before Christmas and built a Samsung.

Oh! One of the local road hauliers has bought two new lorries.
The make : Hino which is owned by Toyota.

Thirty years ago Britain's main exports were motors and aircraft.

I wish I knew the answer what has gone wrong but the more I think about, the more despair I feel.
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Starting Handle Expert

1964 Jaguar Mark 2 3.4 litre
1962 Land Rover Series 2a 88"
2002 BMW M3 E46 Cabriolet

[clan chieftain]

Also I have often wondered why there are so few American cars on our roads.
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The Clan Chieftain

[JC T ONE]

The Danish people was very fond of British cars, but as the Japanese & German built quality overtook, it all went downhill.
All the strikes in UK didnt help, as people didnt want to wait for their new car, or the spares to keep it running.

In 1973 Morris Marina was no 3 with 6996 sold cars here in Denmark.
Opel Kadett was no 5 with 5172 sold cars.

In 1975 Opel Kadett was now up to no 3 with 5446 sold cars.
The Allegro was no 5 with 5167 sold cars

Then in 1978 Opel was up to no 1 with 10730 sold cars.
British Leyland was still no 6, with the Mini, and 4832 sold cars.
This was helped with a very aggressive marketing campagne, together with a very low price on the Mini Special.

After they stoppped the Mini import to DK in 1981, it was pretty much the end of British Leyland in DK


I remember the 60ies, when EVERYBODY was driving British

my Grandfather drowe MG 1300 (later Wolsely 6) and my Father drove MG,s all through the 50 & 60ies.
Started off with a TD (or C?) then MGA twincam, later MGC, and in the end MGB GT, as the family had become too big .
In 1969 he had to surrender, and give up the MG,s he bought a Triumph 2.5 PI, with overdrive, what a car
but sometimes the Lucas injection system, would fail, so he sold it around 1971, and bought a Vauxhall Ventora 3.3 L with manuel box & overdrive.
This was to become his last British car, after the rearaxle had failed a few times, he traded it in, on a Audi 100 GL in 1972.
That was it, my father never went back, he kept buying Audi,s for the rest of his life.
Just before he passed away, he dreamed about getting a MG convertible again but he didnt live to make the dream come true.

My Uncle had a Morris 1100.

Our company service cars, were 2 Mini panel vans
My Mother had a Cooper S (former Danish Champion winning race car)

Ohh the good old days.


Jens Christian
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http://www.eurods.eu/wp/index.html

[ukdave2002]

I think there were a number of causes:

• We got complacent; 30 or 40 years ago our factories were over staffed, I know in one Vauxhall plant the production line was littered with unofficial "rest" area's kitted out with pool tables and and dart boards ...It took a Spanish manager to sort that out.

• In the same period we seemed to care less about quality.

• The Japanese looked at what we did well copied the good bits and improved the rest.

• Labour rates were / are cheaper in the Far East.

• We had more red tape and bureaucracy, than many other European countries; this equated to higher cost.

All the above reduced our ability to manufacture efficiently and export to the rest of the world.

• In the 70's North Sea oil became our export saviour; we began to rely less on traditional manufacturing.

• In the 80 ,90, 00's the financial sector propped up our economy.

Last week the EU put the first knife into our financial sector, by voting that bonuses in the financial sector had to be capped at 100% of base salary. Whilst we can have a pop at the bankers for some of the countries current problems, don't be under any illusion how much the financial sector is propping up the rest of the UK. If we loose our financial sector in the same way that we lost manufacturing I don't see anything that could replace it? The cuts we are seeing now in schools and hospitals would pale into insignificance.

Dave

[Keith D]

This is a very sad thread.

In the 1960/70's Britain simply lost it's way and it's engineering pride. The statement 'Made in Great Britain' was known and respected the world over.

Then along came the Japanese with funny little "riceburner' motor bikes that were so superior in performance to British machines that people just HAD to buy them. The British motorcycle industry just told everybody that they were rubbish and would not last. I know this for a fact as I lived in Britain during those years and watched the British motorcycle industry do absolutely nothing usefull to compete with the Japanese. I had a brand new Triumph motorcycle in 1961 and when three days old, had a fool run into the back of me. It took over three months to get a new rear mudguard from my local Triumph dealer, for a bike that was still being produced!

Then we watched it happen all over again with the British car industry. Bad management, greedy unions, lazy workers, poor quality control, sloppy dealerships.

I still feel angry today when I gaze at Britain and see only one truly British car left, the Morgan. They are still going strong despite "experts" having the absolute arrogance to tell them that they were doing it all wrong a few years ago on television! The "new" Mini may be built in Oxford, but it is definitely NOT British! It's built by a German company!

Many Australians abandoned British cars with very great sorrow. They had no option. Many of us would love to see a British owned industry be resurrected.

Keith

[Roger-hatchy]

It goes through the whole industry

I used to deliver paper to a large printing company in the 70's and 80's, it was opposite a paper mill that produced similar paper.

When asked why not get it from over the road I was told qucker and cheaper to get it from Finland.

All the new developments at London docklands was all imported, including the labour as it was cheaper and quicker, again.

[V8 Nutter]

Poor design, bad management, greedy overpowerful unions, all helped to bring about a can't be bothered attitude in the workforce.

My first ten years at work was working for company that made machines for the motor industry. That is where I found out about the unions.

I then did 20 years engine reconditioning. That is where I found out about bad design

Then another 20 years at a machinery factory, where I saw the rise of the Japanese in this country, and I saw the unions kill car production at Fords.

[V8 Nutter]

On the subject of American cars, I must admit I am a bit biased, I think T.V. programes have a lot to do with them not being popular. They always depict them as gas guzzlers that don't go round corners and have no brakes.

True the suspension on my Caddy is very soft but the MOT tester tells me it records the highest reading on his rollers of any car he tests. On a trip to Yorkshire 300 mile round trip the Caddy used 3 gallons less than a V6 Volvo, and modern Americans are much better

[clan chieftain]

Steelworks went the same way.....Cheaper to import. What bugs me is that the Government sometimes give orders to build ships abroad and the Clyde shipbuilding industry is dying.
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The Clan Chieftain

[JC T ONE]

[pigtin]

[Geoffp]

Don't blame the management or the workforce; the British subsidiaries of Japanese companies are very successful and there are hardly any Japanese staff at any level in them. I worked with a number of companies of all nationalities in Telford in the 90s and they all had the same commitment to quality, customer service and good industrial relations whether they were Japanese transplants or had been in the area since the start of the industrial revolution.

The one consistent complaint by British companies was with successive governments (of all parties) Other countries just went ahead and protected their industries regardless of any international agreements; we were stupid enough to play by the rules and our industry suffered as a result

Geoff

[47Jag]

The annoying thing too is that British engineering talent went on to develop the Korean competition that we now see as the dominant brands here (Kia & Hyundai). George Turnbull the ex MD of British Leyland was hired to develop a car for the world market. The Pony wasn't a great car technologicaly (dare I say a Korean Marina) but it was backed by a long warranty and it was reliable. The rest as they say is history.

Art