Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.
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Roger-hatchy
Joined: 07 Dec 2007 Posts: 2135 Location: Tiptree, Essex
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Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2014 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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With reference to ultra sonic cleaners.
I strapped a random orbital sander to the bottom of a plastic bucket.
Bit noisy but it works for me.
AND it's cheap.
Might try some insulation around it to make it quieter. |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4109 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2014 10:29 pm Post subject: |
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Roger-hatchy wrote: | With reference to ultra sonic cleaners.
I strapped a random orbital sander to the bottom of a plastic bucket.
Bit noisy but it works for me.
AND it's cheap.
Might try some insulation around it to make it quieter. |
Most ultrasonic cleaners operate around 100 KHz, your sander will oscillate around 12k per min or about 0.2 KHz, if it does the job great , but the fact you can hear it means it ain't ultrasonic !
Cheers
Dave |
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RotaryBri
Joined: 20 Dec 2007 Posts: 465 Location: Warwick
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roverdriver
Joined: 18 Oct 2008 Posts: 1210 Location: 100 miles from Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:16 am Post subject: |
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Richard, It is many years since I have had much to do with Veteran cars, and these thoughts might be completely irrelevant, but then again they might help.
Firstly engines, even up to the 1950's were expected to burn oil, that is, a certain amount of oil found its way into the combustion chamber. The earlier the engine, the more likely that is to be the case.
The photo below is of spark plugs made especially for an engine that the design dates from 1908.
Notice how the bottom electrode goes to the side of the center one, and how that bottom electrode has a definite upward bend to its tip. The theory here is that any moisture- non atomised fuel, oil etc., if it lands on the plug will probably land on that electrode, and because of the bend, will gravitate downwards, away from the spark gap, therefore the moisture will not interfere with the ability of the plug to create a spark.
There were, of course, plugs for these particular cars, of almost any design imaginable, but the ones in the photograph have proved themselves over time, are considered the ideal plug for the engine and they have proven longevity, powering the engines for many decades without failure.
Just maybe, the Alldays might need a plug of similar design.
I hope that might help,
Dane. _________________ Dane- roverdriver but not a Viking. |
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Glenn Crawford
Joined: 06 Dec 2007 Posts: 69 Location: Dorset, SW England
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Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 8:39 am Post subject: |
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A pause of ten years and up pops this topic again, suspected premature plug fouling causing a failure to re-start with the engine hot. Usual suspects such as weak spark, fuel vaporisation all eliminated. The car is a Riley RM 1?-litre with mildly improved compression; though rebored and with new pistons some thousands ago it does ingest a bit of oil on the overrun which it blows out in a blue cloud at the bottom of a long hill. So its engine is good though not perfect. And the car is (was) utterly dependable!
I read the article which Green Spark Plugs republish, https://www.gsparkplug.com/shop/fouling-shortingout-problem-modern-plugs-champion-vs-ngk/, suggesting that the insulators of modern plugs in old cars get coated with deposits from petrol, which conduct away the spark. It doesn't happen in newer cars, says the author, because their computers and metering systems prevent this happening. And it only happens now because plug manufacturers have given up glazing their ceramic electrodes, so the conductive deposits can now stick.
In the past ten years has any more come to light on this topic? I don't enjoy driving a formerly reliable car not knowing whether I am going to suffer an embarrassing breakdown. |
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Glenn Crawford
Joined: 06 Dec 2007 Posts: 69 Location: Dorset, SW England
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Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 8:39 am Post subject: |
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A pause of ten years and up pops this topic again, suspected premature plug fouling causing a failure to re-start with the engine hot. Usual suspects such as weak spark, fuel vaporisation all eliminated. The car is a Riley RM 1?-litre with mildly improved compression; though rebored and with new pistons some thousands ago it does ingest a bit of oil on the overrun which it blows out in a blue cloud at the bottom of a long hill. So its engine is good though not perfect. And the car is (was) utterly dependable!
I read the article which Green Spark Plugs republish, https://www.gsparkplug.com/shop/fouling-shortingout-problem-modern-plugs-champion-vs-ngk/, suggesting that the insulators of modern plugs in old cars get coated with deposits from petrol, which conduct away the spark. It doesn't happen in newer cars, says the author, because their computers and metering systems prevent this happening. And it only happens now because plug manufacturers have given up glazing their ceramic electrodes, so the conductive deposits can now stick.
In the past ten years has any more come to light on this topic? I don't enjoy driving a formerly reliable car not knowing whether I am going to suffer an embarrassing breakdown. |
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Glenn Crawford
Joined: 06 Dec 2007 Posts: 69 Location: Dorset, SW England
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Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 8:40 am Post subject: |
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A pause of ten years and up pops this topic again, suspected premature plug fouling causing a failure to re-start with the engine hot. Usual suspects such as weak spark, fuel vaporisation all eliminated. The car is a Riley RM 1?-litre with mildly improved compression; though rebored and with new pistons some thousands ago it does ingest a bit of oil on the overrun which it blows out in a blue cloud at the bottom of a long hill. So its engine is good though not perfect. And the car is (was) utterly dependable!
I read the article which Green Spark Plugs republish, https://www.gsparkplug.com/shop/fouling-shortingout-problem-modern-plugs-champion-vs-ngk/, suggesting that the insulators of modern plugs in old cars get coated with deposits from petrol, which conduct away the spark. It doesn't happen in newer cars, says the author, because their computers and metering systems prevent this happening. And it only happens now because plug manufacturers have given up glazing their ceramic electrodes, so the conductive deposits can now stick.
In the past ten years has any more come to light on this topic? I don't enjoy driving a formerly reliable car not knowing whether I am going to suffer an embarrassing breakdown. |
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Glenn Crawford
Joined: 06 Dec 2007 Posts: 69 Location: Dorset, SW England
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Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 8:40 am Post subject: |
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A pause of ten years and up pops this topic again, suspected premature plug fouling causing a failure to re-start with the engine hot. Usual suspects such as weak spark, fuel vaporisation all eliminated. The car is a Riley RM 1?-litre with mildly improved compression; though rebored and with new pistons some thousands ago it does ingest a bit of oil on the overrun which it blows out in a blue cloud at the bottom of a long hill. So its engine is good though not perfect. And the car is (was) utterly dependable!
I read the article which Green Spark Plugs republish, https://www.gsparkplug.com/shop/fouling-shortingout-problem-modern-plugs-champion-vs-ngk/, suggesting that the insulators of modern plugs in old cars get coated with deposits from petrol, which conduct away the spark. It doesn't happen in newer cars, says the author, because their computers and metering systems prevent this happening. And it only happens now because plug manufacturers have given up glazing their ceramic electrodes, so the conductive deposits can now stick.
In the past ten years has any more come to light on this topic? I don't enjoy driving a formerly reliable car not knowing whether I am going to suffer an embarrassing breakdown. |
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Glenn Crawford
Joined: 06 Dec 2007 Posts: 69 Location: Dorset, SW England
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Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 8:42 am Post subject: |
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A pause of ten years and up pops this topic again, suspected premature plug fouling causing a failure to re-start with the engine hot. Usual suspects such as weak spark, fuel vaporisation all eliminated. The car is a Riley RM 1?-litre with mildly improved compression; though rebored and with new pistons some thousands ago it does ingest a bit of oil on the overrun which it blows out in a blue cloud at the bottom of a long hill. So its engine is good though not perfect. And the car is (was) utterly dependable!
I read the article which Green Spark Plugs republish, https://www.gsparkplug.com/shop/fouling-shortingout-problem-modern-plugs-champion-vs-ngk/, suggesting that the insulators of modern plugs in old cars get coated with deposits from petrol, which conduct away the spark. It doesn't happen in newer cars, says the author, because their computers and metering systems prevent this happening. And it only happens now because plug manufacturers have given up glazing their ceramic electrodes, so the conductive deposits can now stick.
In the past ten years has any more come to light on this topic? I don't enjoy driving a formerly reliable car not knowing whether I am going to suffer an embarrassing breakdown. |
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MikeEdwards
Joined: 25 May 2011 Posts: 2476 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 9:18 am Post subject: |
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You can say that again! _________________ 1976 Vauxhall HP Firenza, 1976 Vauxhall Sportshatch (x2), 1986 Audi coupe quattro, 2000 Audi TT |
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bjacko
Joined: 28 Oct 2013 Posts: 364 Location: Melbourne Australia
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Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:24 am Post subject: Spark plug Fouling |
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Maybe try a set of new plugs. _________________ 1938 Morris 8 Ser II Coupe Utility (Pickup)
1985 Rover SD1 VDP |
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ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4109 Location: South Cheshire
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Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 8:49 am Post subject: |
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Or use a cooler plug? |
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Rootes75
Joined: 30 Apr 2013 Posts: 3828 Location: The Somerset Levels
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Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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I would try another set of plugs from a different manufacturer just to see if anything changes. _________________ Various Rootes Vehicles. |
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