Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.
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garyjpaterson
Joined: 05 Jul 2016
Posts: 30
Location: Aberdeenshire
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 Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2023 5:32 pm Post subject: Ford Sidevalve period modifications - how much power? |
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Just a hypothetical question, absolutely zero plans for performance mods myself. Just curious
Back in the day, what sort of mods were people doing to their Anglia's and Pop's, and what sort of gains could they reasonably expect?
I'm thinking aftermarket heads, manifolds, SU carbs, cams, that sort of thing. If the standard 1172cc motor made 30hp, was 40hp possible? 50? |
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alastairq
Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 1954
Location: East Yorkshire
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| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2023 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | If the standard 1172cc motor made 30hp, was 40hp possible? 50? |
Easily.
For the 1172 10HP engine, fitting the cylinder head from the 8HP engine raised the compression ratio without loss of gas flow. The 'platform' might need altering to suit the dynamo fitting of the 10HP motor.
The 1172 engine [10HP] nowadays would use the 100E cam. This gave slightly better cam timing.
There were more lumpy camshafts produced by the aftermarket industry.
Other 'free' tuning procedures might involve find longer nosed spark plugs.[and the Champion spacers to fit] but beware hitting the valves if too long.
Transfer passages could be opened out quite a bit, unshrouding underneath the inlet valves.
Sage tuning advice of the day said to radius the lip of the cylinder bore to just above where the top ring stopped...
However, in the USA, tuning companies of today [80's,90's, this century] working on money-no-object Ford flathead [sidevalve] V8s, gas flowing on special rigs, have discovered that radiusing the edge of the cylinder bore is counter productive to power....leaving the hard edge in place increased swirl...
Of course, back in the day nobody had the money or the equipment to do such things as gas flow experiments on sidevalve Ford engines.
As an example of a 1172 {10HP} engine I have, used in my Cannon trials car [one]...it had the 8HP head fitted, twin 1 1/8 inch SU carbs on a mixture of no-not-where-from manifolds and home made...Aquaplane exhaust manifold [obtained cheap ]...longer reach spark plugs, and even Nology spark plug cables [from the USA]...Plus electric fuel pump, and external water pump....[mainly because the engine bay is a lot smaller and lower in height than Fords]..On a rolling road [Bogg Bros of East Lutton]...it showed 53 bhp at the rear wheels, at around 4200 rpms.
My current 100E, with AQ head, and manifolds, twin 1 1/4 inch SUs, unknown cam, Hall effect ignition in dizzy, showed on the same rolling road, around 54 bhp at similar rpms.
The easiest{???} method of tuning the Ford side valves would have been to fit a supercharger.
This would give roughy the same bhp figures as above, but a lot more ooomph from tickover. No more than around 5 psi or so needed ....
The best superchargers for eh sidevalve surprisingly probably wouldn't be the Eaton [Roots] lobe-type blowers, but the vane type blowers, that pressurise within the supercharger body itself.
Optimism may abound, but according to an extract from teh MOTOR guide t makes and models [1969], regarding Dellows....which originally used 10 HP Ford engines, either with twin SU carbs, or blown with a single SU carb, as follows.
Twin carbs, otherwise standard 10HP engine. 31 bhp.
Supercharger, single carb, otherwise standard engine [aside from twin valve springs, methinks?] 37bhp.
https://de014b2b-73aa-4d0a-bd58-59010e074433.filesusr.com/ugd/7c7e52_81909ccc9bfd4468a5ed3f7d428d8145.pdf
https://de014b2b-73aa-4d0a-bd58-59010e074433.filesusr.com/ugd/7c7e52_4e400fe88edc4af2a71a31a05b673405.pdf
I'm sure the Dellow Register won't really mind...
_________________
Dellow Mk2, 1951 built, reg 1952.
Fiat 126 BIS
Cannon special [1996 registered. Built in 1950's]
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Ford Pop chassis, Ashley 1172 bodyshell, in pieces. |
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garyjpaterson
Joined: 05 Jul 2016
Posts: 30
Location: Aberdeenshire
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| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2023 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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Cheers for the insight, Alastair, very interesting stuff! |
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Ray White
Joined: 02 Dec 2014
Posts: 6316
Location: Derby
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| Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2023 11:28 am Post subject: |
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I can confirm what Alastair said about radiusing the bores. In my youth I read this advice in a much vaunted book on engine tuning but instead of getting an increase, I noticed a slight drop in power.
Other beliefs "back in the day" included pre heating the mixture before the inlet valves. We now know that cooling the mixture gives a boost.
Currently, the most intriguing approach to improved performance I have read about involves the fitting of an ioniser to the air filter. It apparently makes molecules less stable and more ready to react to combustion.
Someone needs to tell Lewis Hamilton.... |
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Rick
Site Admin
Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 22447
Location: UK
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Penman
Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 4757
Location: Swindon, Wilts.
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2023 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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Rick: Didn't Leslie Ballamy do chassis and running gear mods for the SV Fords?
_________________
Bristols should always come in pairs.
Any 2 from:-
Straight 6
V8 V10 |
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alastairq
Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 1954
Location: East Yorkshire
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2023 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Pops and such like are a bit strangled by their axle ratios though aren't they? |
If one joins the FSOC, one can access all sorts of write-ups on messing with upright rear axle gearing.
There are lower CWPs available from the likes of Small Ford Spares.....plus folk in the club have adapted 100E rear axle CWPs [something like 4.7:1 ratio] to suit the torque tube upright rear axles...
16 inch diameter wheels [from the Prefect] allow access to 175/80 x 16 radial tyres such as Michelin Taxis.....These are somewhere near the same rolling radius as the standard crossplies on 17 inch wheels...but better rubber and carcass
VW wheels [15inch] don't quite fit the stud spacing, so be warned...
Occasionally 15 inch [Ballamy] wheels come on the market, at a price.
So all is not quite lost if looking for lower revs at higher cruising speeds...
_________________
Dellow Mk2, 1951 built, reg 1952.
Fiat 126 BIS
Cannon special [1996 registered. Built in 1950's]
----------------------------------------------
Ford Pop chassis, Ashley 1172 bodyshell, in pieces. |
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