|
Author |
Message |
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:32 pm Post subject: Seized broken bolt. |
|
|
I have a flush broken bolt that hold my water pump on. It is 5.25" long and about 2" goes through the alloy water pump housing, the rest through the alloy timing chest into an alloy block. (who designed this lot, the Marquis de Sade?) The pump will not shift off the bolt which is now a stud, corrosion had got it gripped. I have tried heat, Plus Gas, and I have managed to trepan a 1/2" down the shank and am now using phosphoric acid at 46% (bit stronger that Coca Cola). I am partially disabled and so only have about 20 mins work time at once. I am also working through the rad aperture to get at it square on. Any ideas I haven't tried? Welding a washer/nut is out of the question, the corrosive grip is too great to release anyway.
It is the bolt head seen to the left just under the water pipe and fan boss cut out in this pre strip pic.
Cheers |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mog
Joined: 30 Dec 2007 Posts: 661 Location: Sydney
|
Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Stronger heat with an oxy. torch , if possible. It should break down the corrosion. Good luck ! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 5:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Mog, cheers but nope, it's not having any with the judicial application of heat, although I did discover the flash point of Plus Gas .
The Acid seems to have done a bit this morning, and I had a brain wave last night, I am going to cut some teeth on my home made tube drill for left handed cutting, and bang the drill in reverse hammer action. If the vibration loosens the bolt/stud at least it will be already be heading outwards up the tube drill.
But more pressing work needed doing today, the Khazi flush went AWOL.
John. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
pogo
Joined: 01 Feb 2013 Posts: 51 Location: Limousin. France
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Paul, the problem is the bolt is over 5" long and If I can get the water pump off, 2" of the length, I will then have a 2" stub to play with. The alloy water pump has a grip on the bolt like a scrap mans pit bull. It looks like I'm in for the long haul. The bolt is only 5/16" thread. (8mm).
5/16"x5 1/4" bolt? Into alloy? Madness
Why Oh Why didn't they use studs? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mog
Joined: 30 Dec 2007 Posts: 661 Location: Sydney
|
Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 11:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
Is the water pump scrap or not ? If it is scrap you could drill holes around and break a bit of alloy off around the bolt. How about a new photo of work in progress ? Hit the alloy around the stud with a brass drift and hammer. Even if there is no room for it to move ,it could "bounce " . |
|
Back to top |
|
|
ukdave2002
Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4125 Location: South Cheshire
|
Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 1:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Could you get a slide hammer on the pump?
Another way I have used to free a seized stud is to drill the stud an inch or so, then blast it with freezer spray; freezer spray is used to find electronic faults, it comes in an aerosol with a convenient narrow tube so the spray can be directed into the hole drilled in the stud. If you can get the stud to shrink momentarily and have the action of a slide hammer on the pump at the same time?
Cheers
Dave |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 2:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks Guys, I like the freeze spray idea to break the grip of the corrosion, but I have tried heat and cooling unsuccessfully.
The pump is scrap as the bearing is wobbling and groaning like a fat lad between a pie shop and a chippy, but that is only part of the problem, as for a photo of work in progress, see the above pic and ignore the bolt head.
I have been using a hammer drill when my drill when blunt and that didn't shock it, nearly made me deaf though, now using ear defenders.
I'm making slow progress with my home made tube drill and acid, so I think I might be able to get the pump off. But it is very slow progress.
Once the pump is off I have another 3" ish of timing chest cover which will have the same grip
THEN I've got to get the seized section of thread out of the alloy block.
Who designed this thing, I feel like I'm in some Kafkaesque parallel world! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mog
Joined: 30 Dec 2007 Posts: 661 Location: Sydney
|
Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 5:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
Some years ago I had a Ford 6 cly. and there was a noise under the bonnet. After looking I decided that it was the water pump bearings. I bought and fitted a new pump but the noise was still there. It was the bearings in the alternator, so I took it off and fitted new bearings. No more problem, I always have a smile about that.
At the local hard ware they had some tubular drills that could cut holes in alloy drink cans. I did not take much notice at the time. They could have been cheap with a little bit of diamond dust on the end. They might help on your job. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I changed the alternator bearings this spring, they were u/s. (the needle roller one just fell apart and the ball bearing one was running in rusty paste)
Most of the cars problems are due to its low mileage and lack of use in the last few years of the previous owners life, from the back brakes were seized solid right through to the screen washer pump full of glue like gunge. Each fault has slowly appeared over my 3yrs of custody
I have found a 10m/m od diamond grit tube drill for ceramics on ebay. I can guarantee I'll get the pump off before it arrives |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
WooHoo! Got the B off using a combination of drilling around the bolt/stud, but it still wouldn't budge, then I ran an 10mm diamond grit ceramics tube drill ( best £3.60 I've spent on Ebay) down it as far as that would go, it still wouldn't shift as the tube drill was 1/4" too short. So I banged an old screw driver in the gasket gap and hit it with a BFH. And the B moved!
Chewed hole by the big pipe outlet and the diamond grit drill
Bolt/stud now.
I'm happier than a stud dog with two, well you know, I'm happy
Just to get the broken bolt out now....... |
|
Back to top |
|
|
D4B
Joined: 28 Dec 2010 Posts: 2083 Location: Hampshire UK
|
Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
That's a relief, thought I was going to have to drive up there and lend a
hand..... good luck getting the bolt out |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BigJohn
Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Posts: 954 Location: Wem, Shropshire
|
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
This morning I snuck up on the bolt, attached a small pair of Vise Grips, small so I couldn't have enough leverage to snap the bolt at the root. The wretched thing was finger tight, and oily, it appears to have been put in with gear oil by the smell, if only the water pump bit had been as liberally dosed. But, a result is a result. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mog
Joined: 30 Dec 2007 Posts: 661 Location: Sydney
|
Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 5:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
Well done ! You just have to keep trying with those sort of things. How about a few details of the car ? Or is that on another thread ? V8 for sure . |
|
Back to top |
|
|
ka
Joined: 03 Dec 2007 Posts: 600 Location: Orkney.
|
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:38 am Post subject: Engine ID |
|
|
Rocker box covers look like Rover V8? _________________ KA
Better three than four. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|