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ALTERNATOR ON HILLMAN MINX SERIES V
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Julian



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 278
Location: Warrington

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

welshrover wrote:


Julian. ive put a new battery on when i bought it ,that must of at least made the car worth at least 50.00 Laughing Laughing


OK, the point I'm trying to make here is this:

Forget the dynamo, with a good battery that's charged it will supply roughly 12volts to your lights for some time, thus they should NOT be dimly lit candles even with the engine stopped!

I'm trying to find out if you are just exaggerating the symptoms a little or have a problem withing the battery or wiring? 'Dimly lit candles' is more often than not caused by poor or missing earthing points on the headlamp wiring.

If, on the other hand, they are just not as powerful as the HID bulbs in your new Audi A8 then there could be no problem as such..... Smile

Could you post a video of this on youtube?

Julian.
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welshrover



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 327

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi julian
i tested the dynamo and its ok.by joining the terminals together and putting a voltmeter bettween that and earth and the voltmeter went up rapidly . so i put the volt meter across the battery when it was revved it showed just over 12 volts with or without lights on, with the lights on when it is revved the lights go brighter where as my morris oxford shows 13 + volts and there is no problem with the lights .could it be the regulator needs setting up
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Julian



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 278
Location: Warrington

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

welshrover wrote:
hi julian
i tested the dynamo and its ok.by joining the terminals together and putting a voltmeter bettween that and earth and the voltmeter went up rapidly . so i put the volt meter across the battery when it was revved it showed just over 12 volts with or without lights on, with the lights on when it is revved the lights go brighter where as my morris oxford shows 13 + volts and there is no problem with the lights .could it be the regulator needs setting up


Yes, I'd say so. I'd certainly be tweeking the regulator at this stage. (as I like tweeking things! ) You should get 13.5-14volts output with the engine revved up.

Julian.
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welshrover



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 327

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi julian
is that 13.5 - 14 with the lights on or off and at what rpm about .
thanks craig Smile
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Julian



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 278
Location: Warrington

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

welshrover wrote:
hi julian
is that 13.5 - 14 with the lights on or off and at what rpm about .
thanks craig Smile


Well I'd be doing it with the lights off & you need to rev it up a bit. Obviously not revving 'till valve bounce, but a bit more than just off tickover.

Say about 2000-2500 rpm? It aint an exact science Smile

Jlian.
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welshrover



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 327

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for that,
the regulator was way out it was only pushing out just under 13 volts a 2000rpm the lights still get brighter when revved but not a lot and the indicators are flashing constant now ,just to try it when it gets dark to see if any better, Wink thanks again
craig Smile
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Jim.Walker



Joined: 27 Dec 2008
Posts: 1234
Location: Chesterfield

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh it IS Julian. It IS! An exact science - that is.
We can go on offering random tips, but the correct sequence of tests with a voltmeter and ammeter and the results gained will establish the fault(s) in a few minutes.
The trouble is that we all want to "jump" the gun either through ignorance or impatience to save those few minutes. And nearly always fail. Timewise anyway!
Jim.
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Quote from my late Dad:- You only need a woman and a car and you have all the problems you
are ever likely to want". Computers had not been invented then!
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Bitumen Boy



Joined: 26 Jan 2012
Posts: 551
Location: Above the snow line in old Monmouthshire

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim.Walker wrote:
Oh it IS Julian. It IS! An exact science - that is.
We can go on offering random tips, but the correct sequence of tests with a voltmeter and ammeter and the results gained will establish the fault(s) in a few minutes.
The trouble is that we all want to "jump" the gun either through ignorance or impatience to save those few minutes. And nearly always fail. Timewise anyway!
Jim.


I think the problem most of us have is lack of the correct kit rather than lack of patience - a cheapy multimeter isn't really quite the thing!
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welshrover



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 327

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jobs a good one, my mate came around this afternoon with a tester which i think they must have used on the shuttle, a big box about a foot square with a proper needle that moves up and down and lots of knobs to turn. it was made by G.E.C ELECTRICS .he used it when he worked at a bmc dealer as a mechanic in the 60's .the regulator was out quite a bit, it was putting out about 11 volts according to his tester .(my modern tester was saying it was just under 13 volts ) it now has lights that actually light the road wether fast or slow and the indicators work right too, so good infact the wifes drove her tonight in back lanes with no street lights for miles with no problems:D
thanks again julian for your help
craig
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Julian



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 278
Location: Warrington

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bitumen Boy wrote:


I think the problem most of us have is lack of the correct kit rather than lack of patience - a cheapy multimeter isn't really quite the thing!


Indeed, but those yellow ones from Machine Mart and the like for about 20-30 are pretty good, I've got a few and they are all pretty consistent when checked against each other. The only downside to the things is having to dismantle them to change the internal fuse after testing for volts with the thing still set to read amps Embarassed Embarassed

I still miss my old Universal AVO Mk8 which dies about 30 years ago Sad

Julian.
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Julian



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 278
Location: Warrington

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

welshrover wrote:
jobs a good one, my mate came around this afternoon with a tester which i think they must have used on the shuttle, a big box about a foot square with a proper needle that moves up and down and lots of knobs to turn. it was made by G.E.C ELECTRICS .he used it when he worked at a bmc dealer as a mechanic in the 60's .the regulator was out quite a bit, it was putting out about 11 volts according to his tester .(my modern tester was saying it was just under 13 volts ) it now has lights that actually light the road wether fast or slow and the indicators work right too, so good infact the wifes drove her tonight in back lanes with no street lights for miles with no problems:D
thanks again julian for your help
craig


No problem, nice to see a proper dynamo system working the way nature intended - no need for modern fangled alternators and all that solid-state electrickery!

Julian.
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Jim.Walker



Joined: 27 Dec 2008
Posts: 1234
Location: Chesterfield

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But even your "cheap" tester was telling you the voltage was too low then?
Even though not very accurately.The fully charged battery voltage is 13.2 volts and more that that voltage is needed to charge it fully because any generator or charger has to "force" electricity "backwards" through the battery to charge it.
I did point out in an earlier post that the charging voltage was too low!
Typically an alternator needs to be able to supply 14.7 Volts. I cannot remember off-hand what a dynamo (via the regulator) should supply. But it is similar. The main advantage of an alternator being its current (amps) capacity.
It is rather a long time (probably 25 years) since I used to check dynamo charging systems frequently.
JIm,
_________________
Quote from my late Dad:- You only need a woman and a car and you have all the problems you
are ever likely to want". Computers had not been invented then!
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Jim.Walker



Joined: 27 Dec 2008
Posts: 1234
Location: Chesterfield

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Julian wrote:
Bitumen Boy wrote:


I think the problem most of us have is lack of the correct kit rather than lack of patience - a cheapy multimeter isn't really quite the thing!


Indeed, but those yellow ones from Machine Mart and the like for about 20-30 are pretty good, I've got a few and they are all pretty consistent when checked against each other. The only downside to the things is having to dismantle them to change the internal fuse after testing for volts with the thing still set to read amps Embarassed Embarassed

I still miss my old Universal AVO Mk8 which dies about 30 years ago Sad

Julian.


I have had one of those Machine Mart ones for about ten years. Didn't realise they had a fuse in the Voltmeter circuit. Other individual Voltmeters I have do not, so connecting one (in line) into a circuit would be an expensive experience.
I have never tried it!
Jim.
_________________
Quote from my late Dad:- You only need a woman and a car and you have all the problems you
are ever likely to want". Computers had not been invented then!
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Julian



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 278
Location: Warrington

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim.Walker wrote:
Didn't realise they had a fuse in the Voltmeter circuit.Jim.


My better one has two internal fuses, one does the 10 amps range, & the other does the other (lesser) current range - always worth checking if it seems to be dead.

My old AVO had an external circuit breaker that you could re-set, worked a treat - why everyone has to attempt reinventing the wheel is beyond me.... Cost I suspect Sad

Julian.
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welshrover



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 327

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No problem, nice to see a proper dynamo system working the way nature intended - no need for modern fangled alternators and all that solid-state electrickery!

Julian.
ive gone back to points too, the modern electronic ignition lasted about six monthes ,too be honest it was no better than points ignition ,and i enjoy setting them, for 5 minutes work every few months just to check the gap i cant see the problem. its the first classic, (the hillman is the 15th classic weve owned and havent had a modern car for 14 years ) ive used electronic ignition on ,and it will be the last time i use it. Very Happy
craig
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