Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.

Ellis · Last edited by Ellis on Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:40 am; edited 1 time in total

I grew up in the 1960s and the majority of cars you would see were :

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or
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or
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Ordinary cars for normal people but there were others viewed with respect, reverence even :

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or

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Riley has gone, Rover has gone and Lanchester will only be remembered by few. Look at the cars on the road, thirty years ago one of these was viewed with awe and admiration for those who could afford them:

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Now you see more BMW's than anything else, practically. Audis were revered in the 1960's. I remember a friend of my father buying a new shape Audi 100 in March 1970 and locals viewed it with awe. Not any more.

In 2015 nearly every new car has air con, abs,power steering, in car entertainment so does the badge matter any more? Local people who were loyal to Ford, Vauxhall or the Rover Group are driving Kia, Hyundai and Nissan and there are many Dacia Sanderos around here.

The two or three badges which still have kudos are:

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and

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If you want a luxury car, buy a Lexus. If you want a supercar you can buy a Nissan GTR or a Vauxhall VXR8.

Badges or marques mean little these days.
Do you agree?
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Starting Handle Expert

1964 Jaguar Mark 2 3.4 litre
1962 Land Rover Series 2a 88"
2002 BMW M3 E46 Cabriolet

62rebel · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 4:04 pm Post subject:

your situation is a little different from ours; we went from home-market domination to inundation with foreign-branded domination in a matter of twenty years. I won't split hairs with "foreign-BUILT" as most of the "foreign" builders actually have plants here; just the names. We USED to have serious marque distinctions; those are nearly nonexistent now, with the obvious exceptions of true big money cars... Our "big 3" long ago lost sight of their market identification and went to being "all things to all men", selling every type of vehicle imaginable through nameplates never before associated with such departures from the "norm".... Cadillac now sells station wagons and thinly disguised 4x4 trucks; Lincoln does the same; Chrysler forgot their formula altogether.... Volkswagen lost sight of their mission a good fifty years ago, and most if not all of their lineup should be Audi badged....
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nothing is ever so far gone as to be unsalvageable. see this bolt?.....

goneps · Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 1:08 am Post subject:

Perhaps not quite the sort of response you were hoping to prompt, but as a Morris owner I'm frequently amused that many vintage MG owners appear to have a complex and/or be in denial about their cars' humble origins. In such circles the dreaded monicker "Morris Garages" is the height of sacrilege, guaranteed to offend and wound fragile egos.

Richard

62rebel · Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 3:47 pm Post subject:

I've seen that myself... worked as an apprentice in a British car repair shop and Lord forbid you refer to customer's cars as British Leyland when applicable... as if denial of the era somehow nullified any questionable build quality... and the poor Triumph Spitfires and TR7/8's we had in for work; other owners scoffed at these as poor relations, as well as the ubiquitous Sprites and Midgets.... B's got begrudging respect, but Austin-Healeys were our bread and butter. At that time, no Mini's, Hillmans, Rovers, or Vauxhalls were commonly seen here. I'm sure they would have stratified as well....

What amazed me about British cars in general is that they even managed to get made and sold during times of such stringent economy, and that, by and large, they were sturdy, reliable and efficient, despite stereotyping to the opposite. Anyone with a smattering of mechanical ability can maintain and operate one with little trouble, something impossible to say about the market today....
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nothing is ever so far gone as to be unsalvageable. see this bolt?.....

Ray White · Joined: 02 Dec 2014 Posts: 7076 Location: Derby

I don't think there is much status attached to marques these days. At one time there was real 'snob' value attached to some cars. To my Dad who ran a small garage business, this was a source of much amusement which my brother and I learned to appreciate.

I remember how 'superior' our neighbour was about his new MK11 Jaguar. If there was ever a case of "keeping up with the Jones's" as Mother used to say, then having a Mk11 Jag was right up there. Normally seen in the leafy drives of posh detached houses in the "better" areas, to have a shiny new Mk11 parked in the drive of your bog standard 1950's semi was seen as something special.

Even when we moved "up in the world" the sort of car you had seemed to preoccupy people's minds. When Dad sold off some land for building, the first thing our neighbour wanted to know was what car we would be getting? It was as though if you had a bit of money, you had to have a better make of car to show you had arrived! Of course, my Dad, being a practical engineer stuck to his Fords.

Riley Blue · Joined: 18 Jun 2008 Posts: 1751 Location: Derbyshire

Badge snobbery is alive and flourishing in the UK, particularly in the prestige sctor where BMW, Mercedes, Jaguar and Audi are the chief protaganists.
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David

1963 Riley 1.5
1965 Riley 1.5

peter scott · Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 7211 Location: Edinburgh

I don't play golf but I get the impression any golf club car park will reveal what has snob appeal. I don't think it would cut much ice if I turned up in my 10 year old Mondeo but I like it like that.

Peter Laughing

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https://www.nostalgiatech.co.uk
1939 SS Jaguar 2 1/2 litre saloon

Ashley · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 1426 Location: Near Stroud, Glos

A company called Frontier Leasing keep sending me emails offering an E Class Merc estate car for about £190 a month plus VAT. I believe they're about £42K to buy, so if I see someone in one I can't tell whether he's struggling to shell out a bit over £200 a month for one or if he's just bought it for cash.

Bitumen Boy · Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 2:44 pm Post subject:

Riley Blue · Joined: 18 Jun 2008 Posts: 1751 Location: Derbyshire

I very much suspect that the majority of new cars are leased these days, certanly that seems to be the case around here (Chesterfield, pop. 103,000) where every three years a fresh car appears on driveways. Several of my cars have been purchased (cash every time) at three years old as a result and I'm very grateful other people have taken the depreciation hit - long may it continue though at present I'm quite happy with my 13 year old A8 bought for less than five grand.
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David

1963 Riley 1.5
1965 Riley 1.5

Ashley · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 1426 Location: Near Stroud, Glos

I think you're very sensible David, I do the same despite enormous pressure from the dealer to sign up for a lease as most do. I could always do HP on the remainder after three years of I wanted to keep it. It would have added about 50% to the price of the car, but monthly payments were quite low.

its all tosh, the main thing is to be a nice wysiwyg.

Ray White · Joined: 02 Dec 2014 Posts: 7076 Location: Derby

Ashley · Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 1426 Location: Near Stroud, Glos

What You See Is What You Get. WYSIWYG

Penman · Joined: 23 Nov 2007 Posts: 4850 Location: Swindon, Wilts.

Hi
What always amuses me is the badge engineering snobbery.
Austin
Morris
Wolseley
Riley
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Then for a time there was, albeit not strictly badge engineered
FIAT or LADA
and
FIAT or SEAT
before it became
VW or SEAT
Renault or Dacia
FIAT or YUGO

and in modern people carriers a Ford Galaxy or a VW Sharan (or was it Sharon)
even Volvo S40 or Mistubishi Carisma
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Bristols should always come in pairs.

Any 2 from:-
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lowdrag · Joined: 10 Apr 2009 Posts: 1600 Location: Le Mans

Ah, but would you rather have a Sunbeam Talbot or a Talbot Sunbeam? Rolling Eyes

I grew up in a Ford garage and my Dad drove a Zephyr Mk1. Later he drove a Daimler he had taken in part exchange and I can still smell the upholstery to this day. But when the garage was sold we had a Magnette, and I rate that above all.

Today? I drive the lowest of the low Class C estate, the 200CDi bought used, and I can't get my head around this leasing. Except that it seems to be very advantageous if you are on a fixed budget since you know exactly what your outgoings are. You pay the lease, they service it, they repair it and you hand it back at the end.

I suppose that we, the elder statesmen of the car world, grew up when "hire purchase" was dangerous, when cars weren't reliable, when we worried about 12,000 miles or a one year guarantee expiring, and above all we hated debt like the plague, so we saved and bought for cash, whether new or second hand. I've done 300,000 in the last Mercedes and this one (three years old only) and spent less that £2,000 in repairs. But if I work out the cost of depreciation and servicing and all, the cars have cost around £1,500 per annum. Not far from least costs, so in the end who is right? I have no idea, and perhaps we should all lease.