Classic cars forum & vehicle restoration.

[Ellis]

I consider an overdrive gearbox as one of the most useful components on many of the cars I have owned. My Jaguar Mark 2 has overdrive on top gear (4th) only but the four Triumphs I owned each had overdrive facility on 3rd and 4th. Overdrive third on each was perfect for windy roads.

Both of my current moderns have 6 speed manual gearboxes and I find that I am continually changing gear up and down. The addition of the "Shift" symbol on the Fiat 500L' instrument display is annoying and distracting until I covered it with a piece of black tape.

I have an overdrive unit ready to fit on to my Series One Land Rover and that will allow overdrive on all forward gears - interesting - but I will have to use the clutch. Not quite as easy as an electrically operated overdrive switch.

Which do you prefer - overdrives or 5 /6 speed gearboxes?

[code][/code]
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Starting Handle Expert

1964 Jaguar Mark 2 3.4 litre
1962 Land Rover Series 2a 88"
2002 BMW M3 E46 Cabriolet

[mikeC]

Give me a four-speed plus overdrive every time!

I am appalled at the number of classic cars, which were available at the time with overdrive, which have been 'upgraded' to a modern 5-speed gearbox - Sprites/Midgets I can understand, since there isn't room for an overdrive, but Spitfires and Jaguars? Sacrilege!
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in the garage: 1938 Talbot Ten Airline
Recently departed: 1953 Lancia Appia, 1931 Austin Seven, 1967 Singer Chamois, 1914 Saxon, 1930 Morris Cowley, 1936 BSA Scout, 1958 Lancia Appia coupe, 1922 Star 11.9 ... the list goes on!

[Ashley]

Old BMC gearboxes are grim, noisy and not terribly reliable. Add to that the quality of new syncro cones that last till the end of your drive and Ford or Toyota five speed gearboxes become a gift from heaven. I speak as a Healey 3000 owner where the ratios are all wrong as well. First is too low, second is too low, there's a gap to third and third overdrive is the same as direct top.

I'm told that a Toyota gearbox is quieter and radiates less heat as well, so it is tempting. Or that current overdrive solenoids fail for a pass time, my last did a few hundred miles and overdrive themselves often need rebuilding.....

[Bitumen Boy]

I've never yet driven anything with overdrive, so can't comment on that aspect of it. However, the impression I get from reading about other people's experience of them (mostly Triumph applications) is that overdrives are a delicate and overly-complicated pain in the neck, and if faced with a straight choice of overdrive or 5 speed 'box, I'd probably opt for the 5 speed. However, it's not necessarily that simple. I'd like to do something with my Herald, but although a 5 speed 'box will fit, general opinion is that the ratios of the available 'boxes don't suit the 4 cylinder Triumph engines. Given that I only have 1147cc to play with, I suspect that's not the best option. On the other hand, the idea of adding the complexity of an overdrive with more things to go wrong makes me shudder, given my usual rotten luck with such things. It's academic really as I have neither the time or the cash for any sort of conversion, but I suspect it'll end up keeping the standard 4 speed 'box for the sake of simplicity.

[Keith D]

The Mitsubishi Colts sold in Australia in the early eighties had a dreadful set up consisting of two gear levers. One was for the gears 1 - 4, the other selected low or high ratio. (marked power and economy) In 1987 I bought a new one for my wife and this was the first of the five speed boxes without the two ratios. It was a dream! I hated the earlier two ratio set-up which was really an overdrive unit for all four gears. It was too complicated for comfortable driving. So I would definitely go for the five speed box.

It is important to remember when comparing the old overdrive units with modern five or six speed boxes that modern cars have a far narrower power band and therefore need more gears. Something like a Holden Kingswood, Ford Falcon, or Chrysler Valiant with large lazy 6 cylinder or V8 engines were not available with overdrive when they really should have been! Nowadays many people fit five speed boxes to them and end up with superb long distance highway cruisers.

Keith
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1926 Chrysler 60 tourer
1932 Austin Seven RN long wheelbase box sedan
1950 Austin A40 tourer
1999 BMW Z3
Its weird being the same age as old people.
You are either part of the problem or part of the solution

[peter scott]

Overdrives are really delightful and especially when with well chosen ratios on both 3rd and top.

That said there is little doubt in my mind that a 6 speed box is a more robust solution.

Peter
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https://www.nostalgiatech.co.uk
1939 SS Jaguar 2 1/2 litre saloon

[badhuis]

Do not be "afraid" of overdrives, especially on Triumphs. Twenty years ago I drove a 2000 Mk2 saloon without overdrive, and a neighbor seeing the car offered me one free he still had in his garage. He took it from a car scrapped ten years ago. So I installed, new fluid that and drove happily for five years without problems. Later I had an overdrive on my Mk1 saloon and that was again lovely.
My Austin Westminster has an "automatic" overdrive which is a little harder to understand but even so I like its quirkiness and it actually is quite good.

I have a spare saloon gearbox/overdrive unit and am contemplating installing in my TR4. A small modification is needed but the main worry is that I would loose the typical gear change of the original box. I just love that gear change, it is not fast but a bit truck like. My fear is that the "new" box will change the car too much.

I would always prefer an overdrive over a modern 5 or 6 speed. The new boxes might have a slicker gear change but for me it is all part of the fun you have in an old car.
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a car stops being fun when it becomes an investment

[Ashley]

I agree with you badhuis and have to leave my car original. They're old cars and they have faults new ones don't. If you start modifying where do you stop and when is it time to throw the towel in and just buy a modern.

[alastairq]

I'm going back nearly 50 years in my brain, but I once had the 'use' of a '50's Riley Pathfinder.

[Right side gear lever, etc].....

That had an overdrive fitted.....which could be 'activated by depressing the throttle hard...whereupon it would downshift almost instantly.

Very handy for overtaking..even if it was almost the size of the buses I drove at the time!

[Paul fairall]

5 or 6 speed? where is this utopian place? I have to put up with 3 speed on the popular. 1st gets it moving, just, then 2nd is a little longer and 3rd is 15mph to infinity, oh sorry that was in toy story. I had a vauhall victor FD once with overdrive but it slipped in and out at will and irritated me no end so I didn't bother with it. Seems you chaps really want a refined modern car, overdrive indeed.
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1957 ford popular

[Rick]

[BigJohn]

I've driven four overdrive cars, My Vanguard Phase 2, and that was brilliant, in town left in 2nd and then just flick the o/d in and out as traffic required.
My Triumph 2000 estate, again good and in slow traffic, 3rd and o/d.
A Mk2 Transit long wheelbase twin rear wheel 3 litre V6 Police van, that was great on a fast run as again 3rd and o/d in slower bits then 4th and o/d when at speed.
My Father had an FE VX4/90 with overdrive and it was a godsend as the gearbox was awful, long throw and agricultural. So I'm a fan of overdrives.

[MrWhite]

I have had a couple of overdrive cars when most cars were just 4 speeds and they were a big improvement over the standard 4 speed manual. Nowodays I have a couple of modern 6 peeds and really like them but I wouldn't consider a conversion in a classic car, just wouldn't seem right to me. If it was aclassic rally or track car then maybe as presumably there would already be upgrades, so a couple more useful ones may not go amiss. I might consider adding an overdrive to a classic if it was available from the manufacturer when new but I don't know what this would involve and despite owning cars with overdrive I have no idea how it works, anyone have any links to explain?

[MVPeters]

My amateur understanding of conventional gear-boxes is that 'top' gear is usually a 1:1 ratio - a direct drive with essentially no power loss in the transmission.
Depending on the engine size/power, the final drive ratio & wheel size then determine the top speed designed for that vehicle.
All an 'overdrive' does is to reduce the engine rpms at a given road speed for more relaxed cruising. The penalty is reduced torque, which is why most overdrives only work on 3rd & 4th - if used on 1st or 2nd, you'd probably strip the overdrive gears.
Modern transmissions are different & I'd guess the majority now have the in-direct overdrive built in on the top 1 or 2 gears; no need for a separate unit.
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Mike - MVPeters at comcast.net
2002 MINI Cooper 'S'

[peppiB]

The only 2 cars I have ever had with overdrive were a Sunbeam Rapier (in the 1960's) and an MGBGT in the early 70's. Despite my driving style at the time (some said I was a car destroyer) neither gave me any trouble

Recently I haven't owned a car with a 5 speed box. 12 years ago I owned a Skoda Octavia, but cannot remember much about it (other than it being ultra reliable) even though I drove the thing more than 180,000 miles in 2 years